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  #81  
Old 10-10-2008, 10:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ferre View Post

Why is it that I notice that same pattern of corruption with about every single politician regardless of party afiliation?

When you have a close look at McCain's record, or Biden, or Palin, you'll find the same pattern, it's not exclusively for "one" candidate, somehow it seems to be a requirement to get that high up (electable) in the system nowadays, and it's not exclusively "American" either, I see the same pattern all over Europe too, including my own country.


I'm with Linda when she mentions that parties should be demolished and let politicians be judged on their own personal actions. That would change things rather rapidly I guess.
Could you provide some specific examples of the people you mention?
 
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  #82  
Old 10-10-2008, 10:56 AM
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Here is the google search for Palin lies;
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q...earch&aq=f&oq=

and Biden lies;
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q...earch&aq=f&oq=

It sure looks like lies come with the trade, no?
 
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  #83  
Old 10-10-2008, 10:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Mia View Post
Could you provide some specific examples of the people you mention?
I provided Google searches, just click on them, read some of the lies on there from credible sources and draw your own conclusions.
 
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  #84  
Old 10-10-2008, 11:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ferre View Post
Here is the google search for Palin lies;
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q...earch&aq=f&oq=

and Biden lies;
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q...earch&aq=f&oq=

It sure looks like lies come with the trade, no?
I'm not talking about half truths, exaggerations or lies. I'm talking about "corruption."

Also, I'd kinda like to see specific valid examples, not google searches. I could do a google search for naked pictures of the pope and still probably find results. Its not necessarily going to make it true.

http://www.google.com/search?client=...UTF-8&oe=UTF-8
 
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  #85  
Old 10-10-2008, 11:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ferre View Post
I provided Google searches, just click on them, read some of the lies on there from credible sources and draw your own conclusions.
What do you consider a credible source?
 
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  #86  
Old 10-10-2008, 11:03 AM
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Did I hear correctly earlier on the news that his campaign donated $800,000.00 to Acorn which is under heavy investigation for voter fraud in 12 states?
 
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  #87  
Old 10-10-2008, 11:04 AM
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Originally Posted by thegamerslink View Post
What do you consider a credible source?
Google Searches.
 
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  #88  
Old 10-10-2008, 11:04 AM
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On corruption:

McCain;
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q...on&btnG=Search
Obama;
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q...oq=obama+corru
Palin;
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q...earch&aq=f&oq=
Biden;
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q...earch&aq=f&oq=

 
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  #89  
Old 10-10-2008, 11:05 AM
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http://wordpress.com/tag/biden-corruption/
Here is an easy keyword to tag.
 
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  #90  
Old 10-10-2008, 11:06 AM
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I looked at one of the Google searches, which of those listed in the search do you consider a reliable source? Or is the fact that there have been statements made by several enough of a reliable source?
 
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  #91  
Old 10-10-2008, 11:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thegamerslink View Post
What do you consider a credible source?
With the many sources on those Google searches anyone can pick the sources they find "credible" themselves, for example, the McCain search will bring up Times magazine, AOL news, CNN, Newsweek, etc, same goes for all the other searches, just pick the source you personally find the most credible,..or compare them and draw your own conclusions, as many people do.
 
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  #92  
Old 10-10-2008, 11:12 AM
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Ferre, are you trying to distract from the issues? Because that is what Obama's camp is doing on a daily basis. You can choose to make comments like "All religions are bad" and "All politicians are corrupt" but what good does it do when all you are doing is focus on the negative instead of searching for solutions. Searching for the truth.
America is a democracy. Telling people who to vote for is wrong. You need to shine light into all parties and candidates activities to let the voter make an educated decision.
How can you possibly support the idea of people voting for a candidate they know absolutely nothing about?
If you are ok with Mr. Obama having ties to terrorists and financial affiliations with an organization committing voter fraud, that is one thing. It's another to vote for him not even knowing about it.
The latter is what the Obama camp hopes the American public will do.
As bloggers and webmasters we have a responsibility to bring this to the public's attention so it will not be lost in translation!
 
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  #93  
Old 10-10-2008, 11:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Barr View Post
[I]
Please post any specific objections you may have to my summary of the points established here and I will be more than happy to discuss them further.
It looks like you have all the answers, so let me then ask you a few questions

1. Do you know what happened during 5 years McCain spend in Vietnamese prison?

2. We all know that Moscow was very active in Vietnam and that KGB played active roll in interrogations of Americans POW. Can you with 100% certainty claim that KGB neglected McCain and never took him for “friendly bagels and tea party” on Lubyanka?

3. Do you know what he told and promised to his “friendly” interrogator Comrade General Ivanov and what price he paid for staying alive?

4. ?Maverick? Does going against his own party makes him a maverick? Voting against crucial issues beneficial to his country interests in my book makes him at the very least unpatriotic, in KGB books, it calls: following the orders.

5. Six month ago his campaign ran off cash and he was written off as contender but then the miracle happened (after his KGB handlers all the sadden realized that their man can loose) and McCain came back ontop. I wonder what KGB has on Huckabee, Romney and other gays.

6. “I can see Russia from my windows” she said. Is that why Moscow told McCain to opt as his running mate Sara, the least qualified person in United States of America to be his VP? Hmmm… I wonder what Putin is up to this time?
 
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  #94  
Old 10-10-2008, 11:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ferre View Post
Bob Barr, where did I state "in this tread" when I said it was established that both candidates are liars?
Oh, please. This thread contains specific references to Obama's deceptions regarding his relationship with Ayers. That's what we're talking about here.

You then toss in the vague, unsubstantiated assertion that "It's been established...". By whom? When? Where? With what evidence?

To this point, you have presented no counter-argument to the points that people are making here. Your only defense of Obama seems to be along the lines of "It's OK that my guy lies because we all know that they all do."

(And please don't repeat your claim that Obama is not your guy - your posts clearly indicate otherwise.)
 
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  #95  
Old 10-10-2008, 12:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ranter View Post
It looks like you have all the answers, so let me then ask you a few questions
I do? That's news to me. I've never claimed to have "all the answers", nor do I think that I do.

The topic of this thread is Barack Obama and, more specifically, his relationship with Bill Ayers. If you want to defend Obama, please do. If you want to attack McCain, I'd suggest starting your own thread rather than redirecting this one onto a different topic.
 
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  #96  
Old 10-10-2008, 12:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Barr View Post
3. Ayers and Obama hold in common a lack of respect for their flag and, by logical extension, the country that it represents.


Please post any specific objections you may have to my summary of the points established here and I will be more than happy to discuss them further.
Is the photo that you posted here your basis for the statement I quoted above?
 
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  #97  
Old 10-10-2008, 12:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sitetutor View Post
Ferre, are you trying to distract from the issues? Because that is what Obama's camp is doing on a daily basis. You can choose to make comments like "All religions are bad" and "All politicians are corrupt" but what good does it do when all you are doing is focus on the negative instead of searching for solutions. Searching for the truth.
America is a democracy. Telling people who to vote for is wrong. You need to shine light into all parties and candidates activities to let the voter make an educated decision.
How can you possibly support the idea of people voting for a candidate they know absolutely nothing about?
If you are ok with Mr. Obama having ties to terrorists and financial affiliations with an organization committing voter fraud, that is one thing. It's another to vote for him not even knowing about it.
The latter is what the Obama camp hopes the American public will do.
As bloggers and webmasters we have a responsibility to bring this to the public's attention so it will not be lost in translation!
I agree with you that voters should be informed about who they vote for. However, I do not agree with you when you spread rumours as facts, as you did when you started this tread.

Sure, Obama has some serious issues which make him not-the-ideal-president, I agree with anyone who points that out, but you are spreading rumours which are not based on anything but your will to slander him and spread (for all we know) false rumours, which doesn't make you any better. In fact by doing this you could loose your own credibility.
 
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  #98  
Old 10-10-2008, 12:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Zap View Post
Is the photo that you posted here your basis for the statement I quoted above?
Yes, those are the ones.

The photo of William Ayers shows him standing on an American flag in 2001. Wouldn't you agree that standing on one's country's flag constitutes a level of disrespect toward that flag?

In Obama's photo, his failing to place his hand over his heart during the pledge of allegiance (contrary to common and expected practice in this country) constitutes, to me at least, a similar disrespect toward the flag. Do you disagree with that assessment?
 
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  #99  
Old 10-10-2008, 12:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Barr View Post
Oh, please. This thread contains specific references to Obama's deceptions regarding his relationship with Ayers. That's what we're talking about here.

You then toss in the vague, unsubstantiated assertion that "It's been established...". By whom? When? Where? With what evidence?

To this point, you have presented no counter-argument to the points that people are making here. Your only defense of Obama seems to be along the lines of "It's OK that my guy lies because we all know that they all do."

(And please don't repeat your claim that Obama is not your guy - your posts clearly indicate otherwise.)
Dude, first off, this tread started out with a lie/rumour. I asked for a source, which is one of the forum rules btw, and did not get one, then to distract from the actual subject, which was a false rumour to begin with, all sort of other accusations have been given in order to discredit Obama, fine by me, but I pointed out that even republicans do not all agree with the viewpoints presented about the Obama/Ayers connection and provided links to back this up.

You keep spreading the LIE that I would be supportive to Obama, which I am not and have stated earlier, I'm supportive to backing up slander with sources, whether those facts are about you, Obama, McCain or anyone else for that matter.

Sure, you can keep on telling me that I'm a "Obama supporter" but that is just as ridiculous as telling me that I'm a McCain supporter. I just don't see why people should be slandered with rumours and I would ask for sources if you were the guy being slandered just as well, although, judging your posts, I wouldn't be supportive of you either when you were running for president.
 
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  #100  
Old 10-10-2008, 12:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Barr View Post
Yes, those are the ones.

The photo of William Ayers shows him standing on an American flag in 2001. Wouldn't you agree that standing on one's country's flag constitutes a level of disrespect toward that flag?
Yes. I agree. Not very respectful of the flag.

In Obama's photo, his failing to place his hand over his heart during the pledge of allegiance (contrary to common and expected practice in this country) constitutes, to me at least, a similar disrespect toward the flag. Do you disagree with that assessment?[/QUOTE]
I would disagree with that assessment. I have seen this photo a few times now but have not heard of any incidents where Obama has stepped on, burned or otherwise disrespected the flag (if you discount the act of not putting one's hand over heart as a sign of disrespect). Perhaps it has happened. I just have no knowledge of such an event.
I would offer this... In Canada, such an action (to not place hand over heart) means nothing. Some do it, some don't. The ones who don't are generally not looked upon as disrespecting anything by that action.
If that's the only "evidence" of disrespecting the flag, then I think it's weak. He's standing at attention. He's not stuffing donuts in his mouth or talking on his cell phone or watching TV. He looks respectful enough to me, even if he isn't following every single point of protocol that you deem necessary. He still appears (to me, at least) to be respectful of the flag. I also think it's quite a leap to jump from that to saying he doesn't respect his country. Some would argue that he has the right to disrespect the flag if he wants to. It's one of the things the USA stands for... the freedom to do things like disrespect the flag. So, given that, if he even was disrespecting the flag, wouldn't that mean he actually has respect for his country?
 
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