Amersterdam Closing Many Marijuana Cafes

[Buskerdoo]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28083380/?gt1=43001

Ferre, dude what's up with your progressive country?

[FocalPoint]

Just couldn't resist adding some color and grit before the discussion begins....Jacques Brel:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T6rvM...eature=related

Also, David Bowie did a more languid version in English.....

http://alexdeve.vox.com/library/vide...3060a0005.html

[homebizseo]

Why are they closing?

[Ferre]

Not all coffeeshops are closing, only a few, ...if any.

The Christian-right government has come up with new laws which prohibit coffeeshops in close range to schools. Some coffeeshops are too close to schools according to the new regulations and there is "talk" that they need to close...HOWEVER,.. what's not mentioned in the foreign media is that the Mayor, Job Cohen, is not at all going to close those shops down just like that. At the moment he's evaluating the situation and has already exempt a bunch of shops

Then there's this attempt from some prude local bureaucrats to reduce the amount of brothels and sex shops, hehhe, the Amsterdam population isn't really at par with those guys and we wish them luck trying what no bureaucrat could manage to do in the past 400 years.

[James Trotta]

Wow - If Ferre is right (and I suppose the chances are good), then that AP article is some real crappy and misleading journalism.

Originally Posted by Ferre

Not all coffeeshops are closing, only a few, ...if any.

The Christian-right government has come up with new laws which prohibit coffeeshops in close range to schools. Some coffeeshops are too close to schools according to the new regulations and there is "talk" that they need to close...HOWEVER,.. what's not mentioned in the foreign media is that the Mayor, Job Cohen, is not at all going to close those shops down just like that. At the moment he's evaluating the situation and has already exempt a bunch of shops

Then there's this attempt from some prude local bureaucrats to reduce the amount of brothels and sex shops, hehhe, the Amsterdam population isn't really at par with those guys and we wish them luck trying what no bureaucrat could manage to do in the past 400 years.

[Ferre]

Originally Posted by James Trotta

Wow - If Ferre is right (and I suppose the chances are good), then that AP article is some real crappy and misleading journalism.

Well, according to AP Saddam had weapons of mass destruction. need I say more?

[Atom]

An excerpt from the OP article: Marijuana is technically illegal in the Netherlands (...)

I didn't realize this. I thought that it was legal there.

[Atom]

Originally Posted by Atom

An excerpt from the OP article: Marijuana is technically illegal in the Netherlands (...)

I didn't realize this. I thought that it was legal there.

Sounds pretty fishy.

It should be legal, period. In all countries.

[dWhite]

Originally Posted by Atom

It should be legal, period. In all countries.

The reason why it's illegal here, and available in coffee shops over there is one simple thing. They smoke it and don't get stupid, or do stupid things.

We have people smoking it over here, who go out and get killed or injured because they got too high.

[Atom]

Originally Posted by dWhite

The reason why it's illegal here, and available in coffee shops over there is one simple thing. They smoke it and don't get stupid, or do stupid things.

We have people smoking it over here, who go out and get killed or injured because they got too high.

Oh? How many people over here (USA) would you say got killed or injured from smoking weed?

[Rchid29]

Originally Posted by dWhite

The reason why it's illegal here, and available in coffee shops over there is one simple thing. They smoke it and don't get stupid, or do stupid things.

We have people smoking it over here, who go out and get killed or injured because they got too high.

it can actually be legalized, but it depends on how a country's government put some restrictions on who can consume it and how much is the limit for legal consumption. Just like in some countries in Europe wherein these kinds of stuff are sold legally, only those people who are legible are allowed to buy, but with a limit in dosage, age, etc.

[Atom]

Originally Posted by dWhite

(...) We have people smoking it over here, who go out and get killed or injured because they got too high.

You cannot get "too high" from THC, it's not that kind of drug, not like alcohol, for example, where the more you drink the drunker you get.

[Ferre]

Originally Posted by Atom

An excerpt from the OP article: Marijuana is technically illegal in the Netherlands (...)

I didn't realize this. I thought that it was legal there.

Dutch politics don't work exactly as anywhere else Atom. What we have in the Netherlands is a very small percentage of the population who actually votes. This has caused two groups of people who (en masse) do vote, the christian right and the socialists to dominate our political spectrum with their parties.

Now comes the funny part; the Christian right and the socialists are minorities in our society, no one bothers to take them seriously and most of the laws and regulations they come up with can not be enforced simply because the mayors in the towns, who are the head of the local police force at the same time, do not enforce laws which are ignored by a majority.

Take the new mushroom ban for example, it was all over the (international) press that the Netherlands banned mushrooms as of 1st, December...fact is that the Amsterdam Mayor already has declared that he does not have the (man)power to enforce that law and now the government has the problem of figuring out what department could do that and at the end of the day, practically, mushrooms are only banned on paper, just like weed is only banned on paper. Same goes for the smoking ban in bars and restaurants, many bars allow smoking in the Netherlands, when they get fined they just pay the fine and allow it anyway, but they hardly get fined, only a couple of government fanatics try and enforce it and those inspectors need police protection when they do, they are not exactly welcomed with happy smiles by the Dutch people when they enter a bar to "inspect for smokers", they got kicked out of a couple of bars already by angry citizens. The present situation is that most of the time when those inspectors ask for police protection to enter bars to inspect them the police tells them they have no manpower-at-that-time and this effectively reduces the inspections that are actually carried out.

Don't get me wrong, the Dutch are not a lawless bunch of people, they are hard working responsible people, they have low crime rates, low drug abuse rates (including alcohol) and do economically very well but in general they just don't buy being patronized by those they pay to govern their country and they also don't buy christian calvinist morals pushed upon them by laws, history shows that this has been tried before and it never worked.

[Atom]

Originally Posted by Ferre

Dutch politics don't work exactly as anywhere else Atom. What we have in the Netherlands is a very small percentage of the population who actually votes. This has caused two groups of people who (en masse) do vote, the christian right and the socialists to dominate our political spectrum with their parties.

Now comes the funny part; the Christian right and the socialists are minorities in our society, no one bothers to take them seriously and most of the laws and regulations they come up with can not be enforced simply because the mayors in the towns, who are the head of the local police force at the same time, do not enforce laws which are ignored by a majority. (...)

This is interesting to me. I am delighted that such a system even exists in today's political climate. I suspect you still have your work cut out for you in getting weed completely legal over there though, and of course it seems it's likely even harder here, as I believe that there just aren't enough non-voters here in the US to allow meaningful exploration of such an alternative.

[Ashley27]

Originally Posted by homebizseo

Why are they closing?

To lessen crimes...

[ranter]

Originally Posted by Ashley27

To lessen crimes...

Can you be more specific... what crimes are you talking about?

[James Trotta]

Ferre, can I quote some of this on a blog post about Amsterdam travel?

[Ferre]

Originally Posted by James Trotta

Ferre, can I quote some of this on a blog post about Amsterdam travel?

Sure.

Btw, according to the Dutch government, the mushroom ban doesn't include people using them. Dutch people are still allowed to pick them from the fields (they grow about everywhere) or grow them themselves at home and get high on them.

The ban is only for "sales", not for "use" or "cultivation".

Source link here: http://www.ad.nl/binnenland/2815681/...oor_thuis.html (Dutch though)

The above newspaper article also mentions the Mayor of Amsterdam's remarks about him not going to enforce it at the end.

And here is a link to a Dutch newspaper article which explains about the failure of the smoke ban.

http://www.parool.nl/parool/nl/32/On...-mislukt.dhtml

There are a lot more articles like that to be found in the Dutch press but foreign (AP) journalists just repeat and write what politicians tell them, they don't do any research anymore nowadays or report from different angles, all they are is an extension of government's propaganda departments all over the world. They lost contact with the real world where real people live who make their own desicions. (Well, at least that's what it looks like to me most of the time)

[rabble]

Originally Posted by Ferre

There are a lot more articles like that to be found in the Dutch press but foreign (AP) journalists just repeat and write what politicians tell them, they don't do any research anymore nowadays or report from different angles, all they are is an extension of government's propaganda departments all over the world. They lost contact with the real world where real people live who make their own desicions. (Well, at least that's what it looks like to me most of the time)

Your description of the mainstream media is spot on.
Glimmers of hope shine in independent media, but the main stream news media,
primarily funded by corporate advertising revenues, is obsequiece.

[spacefem]

it sounds nice but i don't totally get it. wouldn't it just be easier to vote? then your government wouldn't be wasting time trying to enforce laws that aren't realistic.