Do you believe Homosexuals Are Not "Born That Way."?

[krahmaan]

You seem to be more closer to the truth than you even know.

Originally Posted by Zap

And, on the topic of your friend, Dan the man. Perhaps he was more confused than he was gay. Maybe he's bisexual and mariage to a woman was a better option for him than marriage to a man. If he lives in most US states, I'd say that was a certainty.

Here, you say that my friend was possibly more confused than gay. Just a hypothesis on what you just said. Since my friend was possibly more confused, then why could this not apply to all people who think they are gay? As a hypothesis, couldn't they all be a bit confused? Since you just stated that my friend possibly was. Then you went on to say that he chose a woman as a better consequence to his sexual preferences, for his own life and his future. Now why couldn't this same option not apply to all homosexuals? As better choices with better consequences for their very own lives and futures?

As I said before, it seems that you may be on to something here. You've state a truth about homosexuality better than I could have -IMO. And I bet you didn't even know that you did this so well. As it is with TRUTH.

BTW, I think I stated this in another thread on a similar topic but I haven't had any sexual relations for about two years now. For Spiritual purposes of course, but I do plan to marry one day. If I'm blessed with a loving woman, and if I live to see that day come -I may not be, for I do not claim to see the future.

Originally Posted by ranter

Maybe because then there was no an army of pharma companies that nowadays will offer you pill for every possible occasion.

Just a thought.

This is why I prefer more natural techniques and remedies to well being. Many pills prescribed by some doctors are just placebo. The FDA is one of the biggest businesses -IMHO.

kudos.

[krahmaan]

Originally Posted by Zap

K-Man: I'm not going to speak to the specific comparison (being born black and/or gay). But your post on the topic is very telling about your views so I wanted to use it to illustrate another point entirely.
You keep saying that gays are not born gay because they can control their desires, as heterosexuals do at work, etc. But that thinking completely side steps the issue at hand. I don't know if you do it intentionally or not, but choosing when/where to have sex is NOT equal to choosing who you want to have sex with.
You say a gay person has a choice. They can choose not to be gay by abstaining from sex. That's no more maintainable than a black person choosing not to be black by painting their body in white paint. A black man in white paint is still a black man. Just as a gay person who doesn't have sex is still gay. The choice is not in the colour of the skin or the sexual orientation. The choice is in how they deal with it. The same thing goes for heterosexuals. I choose not to have sex at work because I want to keep working, but that doesn't change the fact that I still want to have sex with women only.

Zap, I wanted to address this part of your post with a entirely different post. I want to make myself clear on this, because I won't be addressing this particular issue any longer.

When people speak about gays, then bring up black people as if there is some kind of correlation, this is highly offensive. Because they only bring up black people when they do this -mostly. Why not bring up gays, then bring up Europeans in correlation? Or how about Asians, Indians, or Samoans? My point being that they always bring up blacks, as if being black is related to being gay. Or as if all blacks are gay. They might have not said that, but this correlation surely implies this slander -IMO. So then it becomes an insult.

I hope this make it clear to why I see no correlation between being persecuted as gay or otherwise. Choosing who you want to have sex with has nothing to do with being born from/in a different creed. I hope this makes sense.

[Muddy]

Sorry K. your logic isn't working for me in any way, shape or form so I'm going to have to leave you to your own belief. I think you're a nice guy though.

[Cornbread]

Infants aren't born sexual, that is something that is developed as they mature in accordance with their social environment. Homosexuality is a choice and it's definitely not the natural order of life on earth. If it was, mankind would cease to exist because it wouldn't be able to reproduce. Except for man, animals mate to reproduce.

[Atom]

Originally Posted by Cornbread

Infants aren't born sexual, that is something that is developed as they mature in accordance with their social environment. Homosexuality is a choice and it's definitely not the natural order of life on earth. If it was, mankind would cease to exist because it wouldn't be able to reproduce. Except for man, animals mate to reproduce.

This is contrary to the facts and current consensus as stated here:

http://borngay.procon.org/

and I also disagree with your last sentence as stated. A male dog, for example, reproduces because he is horny, period.

[Atom]

People have sex because they are horny, period. You can question why it is that people and animals are horny all day long, but that is actually inconsequential. Reproduction is, in reality, inadvertent to the primary instinct, sex. Reproduction is not a primary instinct, it is simply the inadvertent result of one.

[Cornbread]

Originally Posted by Atom

This is contrary to the facts and current consensus as stated here:

http://borngay.procon.org/

and I also disagree with your last sentence as stated. A male dog, for example, reproduces because he is horny, period.

You said it yourself, a dog reproduces, he does it out of instincts, how do you know he feels "horny" as you do? He is instinctually drawn to a female dog which has the result of keeping his species alive.

Those aren't facts and a consensus doesn't mean anything. The pro gay media is trying to confuse people with nonsense. When the gay marriage topic has been put to a vote it has almost always lost.

Sorry, babies are not born gay, they develop those twisted thoughts later in life. It is not instinctual for one man to lust after another man's hairy butt.

[Atom]

Originally Posted by Cornbread

You said it yourself, a dog reproduces, he does it out of instincts, (...)

I like to take things one step at a time, please forgive me.

Nope, I did not say "a dog reproduces, he does it out of instincts". Please read my previous two posts again.

[LastManOut]

[Edit: this is not the place to introduce yourself or promote your services.]

[Atom]

A male dog does NOT reproduce out of instinct, IMO. He DOES have sex out of instinct, again IMO.

[Cornbread]

Originally Posted by Atom

I like to take things one step at a time, please forgive me.

Nope, I did not say "a dog reproduces, he does it out of instincts". Please read my previous two posts again.

Obviously we are not going to change each others opinion on these forums, so we can just agree to disagree. There will never be any scientific proof, science can't explain may things, especially how a persons soul "feels" when it's born.

To me it boils down to faith in God, I have faith that God would never create a gay baby, but of course he gives us all free will to make our own choices later in life.

[Atom]

Originally Posted by Cornbread

Obviously we are not going to change each others opinion on these forums, so we can just agree to disagree. There will never be any scientific proof, science can't explain may things, especially how a persons soul "feels" when it's born.

To me it boils down to faith in God, I have faith that God would never create a gay baby, but of course he gives us all free will to make our own choices later in life.

Homosexuality is clearly incorrect to me. Then again, I'm not gay. I suppose if I was it would seem natural and unnatural at the same time.

[ranter]

Originally Posted by Cornbread

You said it yourself, a dog reproduces, he does it out of instincts, how do you know he feels "horny" as you do? He is instinctually drawn to a female dog which has the result of keeping his species alive.

Atom is right.

Dog is one of the most gay(ish) animal and will f*** everything dead or alive.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o_n6XNkzS00
http://video.filestube.com/video,1d6...d51d103ea.html

In a wolf pack dominant male will f*** subordinate male just to show who is in charge.
You may learn something if you Google for “bonobos chimps”

As to the rest of your brainstorming, why don’t you read same of mine?
http://www.middlefingeraward.com/vie...1037f18e4e282a

[Atom]

Well I suppose if I referred to dogs as nasty little devils it'd be somewhat like the pot calling the kettle black. lol. I don't know, it seems to me that we are primarily sexual beings and spiritual beings at the very same time. Weird stuff.

I suppose not having several children by different mothers seems reasonable, but is it ultimately correct?

[Atom]

Oh sure, Atom, throw marriage out the window while you're at it.

Sorry..

[Atom]

Well, I am not sure what the heck ails me, but I'm sure it's nothing a good exorcism wouldn't cure.

[ranter]

Originally Posted by Atom

I suppose not having several children by different mothers seems reasonable, but is it ultimately correct?

Yes Sir Atom, it isn't correct

I’m sure somebody going to correct me but… when God said: go and procreate, he never said one man one woman, he just said, I made sex as pleasurable as mama’s pie so you shall have sex as many times as you possibly can and while pleasuring yourselves you shall procreate many of my children.

[Cornbread]

Originally Posted by ranter

Atom is right.

Dog is one of the most gay(ish) animal and will f*** everything dead or alive.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o_n6XNkzS00
http://video.filestube.com/video,1d6...d51d103ea.html

In a wolf pack dominant male will f*** subordinate male just to show who is in charge.
You may learn something if you Google for “bonobos chimps”

As to the rest of your brainstorming, why don’t you read same of mine?
http://www.middlefingeraward.com/vie...1037f18e4e282a

Being gay is a mental illness. A man chooses whether he wants to hump a tree or a donkey or another man's anus which, by the way was built as an exit only. So is a killer, born a killer, with some evil genetic code? or is he born a good person and later in life chooses to murder?

The medical community has even had some success in curing some gay people, why don't you give it a try ranter. Maybe in the future this won't be an problem, maybe they will have an early test and give people the cure before they turn completely gay. Here is more data on the cure that has been used successfully: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8016013.stm Dr Nicolosi has been curing gays for about 25 years.

[ranter]

Originally Posted by Cornbread

Maybe in the future this won't be an problem, maybe they will have an early test and cure.

Like, how early?
Maybe the day they're born?
who says that being gay is a problem?
whose problem it is?
why would you cure something that isn't contagious?

[krahmaan]

Cancer isn't contagious either. But I bet people would love a cure.

I think what it all boils down to is that the main problem with the world today is that parents aren't disciplining their kids. That's it. There's too much leniency going on, now-a-day parents are being threatened by social services about taking away their children if they whip them. So now they are afraid to do so. I was lucky enough to grow up in a family with the slogan, "spare the rod, and spoil the child."

Parents now-a-day will let a child do things like; talk back, throw things, wear make-up, throw tantrums, play in the house, drink, do drugs, smoke cigarettes at an early age, sometimes even abuse the parent. And then when all the sudden one of the kids claims to be gay, the father will say, "Oh, it's alright and I accept it." While deep down within he hates the fact. Then becoming a hypocrite accepting something he 'clearly' disagrees with. Especially if it's his son. Believe me, I know. I have a friend who has confided something similar to this to me.

I understand his hidden grief, but he didn't know what else to do. I told him that he should spend some time with his son, not only show him how to be a man. But what it means to be one -also. Many young boys don't have a father there to show them the ropes. That is the love boys need from their fathers to become men -real men. Not some hypocritical gay acceptance. You can't just let kids do whatever they want, that throws parenting out the door!

Men now-a-day are lacking a sense of honor. A man's word means nothing, and he thinks it's OK. Then he teaches this to his son. This is why more and more are becoming gay I believe.