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Old 11-05-2009, 09:49 AM   #61 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robjones View Post
So one person has shown support for a potentially specious position and you attribute it broadly to "many of you"?

OK, I stand corrected. The fallacy you utilized is named "Guilt by Association".
That would be true if I erroneously failed to recognize the hundreds or thousands (my estimate) who will read the content of this thread and never post in it.
My point was to anyone who's sucked into the witch burning mentality.
(And there are plenty of them around)

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Originally Posted by robjones View Post
Notwithstanding that... yeah, if I personally knew someone raped my daughter I'd be very likely to consider non-judicial corrective action, but I don't think that position applies to the majority of those that oppose your position. Bear in mind I have the advantage of perfect judgment and total omniscience. [You may now kiss the ring if you wish my child.] :-)
At least you keep your sense of humour about you.
As the father of a daughter, myself, I honestly can't say what I would do to someone guilty of raping her, but I would want to be damned sure that the person I was considering doing unspoken things to was actually guilty of the crime.
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Old 11-05-2009, 09:50 AM   #62 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Cricket View Post
Zap you and I disagree on a number of political and social issues but I appreciate and respect your thoughts and opinions because it brings balance to topics and it helps me the think through the way I feel about things, opens my mind a bit. We can disagree without being disagreeable, ya know?
Couldn't agree more and I believe Rob is of the same mindset.
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Old 11-05-2009, 09:56 AM   #63 (permalink)
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Zap and I dont get personal, we're firmly aware the other is on the flipside of the political spectrum, but neither of us takes body shots... just a bit of sparring. Wouldnt have it any other way. Seeing other perspectives is a good thing... you cant learn by talking just to people that agree with you.
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Old 11-05-2009, 09:57 AM   #64 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by robjones View Post
Zap and I dont get personal, we're firmly aware the other is on the flipside of the political spectrum, but neither of us takes body shots... just a bit of sparring. Wouldnt have it any other way.
OK. That was below the belt.

And, for the record, we may differ on some issues, but I might surprise you from time to time.
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Old 11-05-2009, 10:02 AM   #65 (permalink)
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Hell Zap, most people consider it a compliment to be thought of as not agreeing with me.
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Old 11-05-2009, 10:11 AM   #66 (permalink)
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Nice post. Thanks for sharing.
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Old 11-05-2009, 10:16 AM   #67 (permalink)
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Was gonna follow up with comments but will have to do so later...someone just stopped by.
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Old 11-05-2009, 10:24 AM   #68 (permalink)
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*reports muddy for post-padding*
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Old 11-05-2009, 10:57 AM   #69 (permalink)
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*reports Rob for excessive reporting*
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Old 11-05-2009, 11:40 AM   #70 (permalink)
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Okay, People! I'm back from my real life!

I like the way you think, Zap, honestly, I do!

But tell me again how you feel about the justice system when you have 250 pounds of meat pressing you to the floor against your will...

I don't think even one of us here can truly understand exactly how degrading and life-altering rape really is unless it has actually happened to us. (Rape was used as a weapon in Bosnia and it is being used as a weapon in several countries in Africa right now. Armed thugs enter a town and actually rape women right in the street, where everyone can see it but none have the power to do anything about it without sacrificing their own life.)

http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/africa/10/24/amanpour.congo.rape.documentary/index.html

I've never been raped (thank God) so I can't speak from experience and can only go by my thoughts on the subject. But my little sister has. (And the only reason the guy is still breathing is because I haven't been able to find him.) And because of that terrifying encounter with that stranger, she now has a daughter by him to remind her of it the rest of her life.

But I have had a loaded handgun pressed to the side of my head by criminals, and I can tell you for a certainty I was NOT thinking about having them arrested, taken to court and found guilty of their crimes.

I was wondering if they were going to pull the trigger or not. I was thinking about taking that handgun away from them and beating them to death with it, after I unloaded it into them. That's what I was thinking. (That was before I became a gun owner. Now that I am a gun owner, people who point weapons at me flat out get shot.)

If it was to be, it was up to ME, not the police, not the courts, not the legal system of justice. MY life was on the line and I was the only one who could do anything about it. Lucky for me, I lived to tell about it, as they decided to let me live. (Believe me, you don't want to know how I feel about someone else deciding if I should live or not.)

So go with the legal system if you want. That's your choice. (I believe in choice.)

Worry day and night about his 'friends' doing something to you before the court date.

Go ahead and take the stand after being raped and beaten by a stranger and testify against him and watch him sitting there giving you a cold hard stare, and be humiliated by the defense attorneys who definitely WILL say you were asking for it, that you dressed provocatively, that it was your own fault for being in that bar and drinking so much and that you were the one who was 'coming on' to them.

Or that it was your own fault for leaving your bedroom window unlocked at night and sleeping on top of the blankets because it was so hot, you were the one who tempted this poor man when he looked into your bedroom window and seen you lying there so sexily, just begging for some good lovin'.

Forget about the fact that he shouldn't have been staring in your window, you should have had the sense to cover up with a sheet or something. But you didn't, you tempted this poor man, you asked for it!

And let's not forget that the defense will closely and publicly examine your love/sex life with a fine-toothed comb, too, (as if it's any of their business) and do their best to paint you as a whore, as an easy woman who has no morals. Everyone in court will get to hear the titillating details as they stare at you and think you are nothing but a cheap hussy.

And after going through all of that, watch as the judge or jury gives the (expletive) probation and cuts him loose to possibly come by your house and beat you and maybe even kill you for testifying against him.

Then tell me again how you feel about the legal system.

The legal system is for the protection of the weak and those who are too stupid, too lazy or too inept to put themselves in a position where they can protect themselves against these types of scum.

The legal system is designed to penalize those who actually have the guts and nerve to take the law into their own hands instead of asking their attacker to hold on while they call the police.

By the time the police arrive, assuming you actually get the chance to call them, you may be dead.

Ask not what you're country can do for you, ask what you can do for YOURSELF!

Walk softly and carry a loaded weapon...forget the stick.

If more criminals were killed, those who were left might think twice about messing with people.

There are so many convicts in society who have no fear of prison. As a matter of fact, they have so many buddies in prison it's like homecoming when the bus drops them off. Again.

They laugh at the courts. Prison is a revolving door and carries no weight to prevent many from committing the same crimes again when they are released back into society.

But if they know there's a very likely chance they will be on the wrong end of a bullet?

Most of them will whistle a different tune.

Innocent people, what about them? Well, there are innocent people sitting on death row right now (at least that's what they all claim). The legal system itself kills innocent people, so if I happen to drop a couple, do you think I'm going to care? (If I shoot at you, I definitely don't think you are innocent!)

When you're within an arm's reach of a murderer, molester, rapist intent on harming you, few things will matter to you right then.

It will be survival of the fittest.

Lots of luck with that...
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Old 11-05-2009, 11:59 AM   #71 (permalink)
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"The legal system is for the protection of the weak and those who are too stupid, too lazy or too inept to put themselves in a position where they can protect themselves against these types of scum."

Well said Allen!
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Old 11-05-2009, 02:01 PM   #72 (permalink)
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People who I think should be killed:

11th body found at sex offender's home

by Vicki Smith and Meghan Barr - Nov. 4, 2009 05:39 PM
Associated Press

CLEVELAND - The run-down Cleveland neighborhood where 50-year-old Anthony Sowell quietly carved out an existence is the type of place where women can disappear almost in plain sight.

Where crack users sneak into vacant houses to do drugs, have sex, then steal copper pipes and wiring to make a few bucks.

Where no one asks a lot of questions, even about the smell of rotting meat that came when the wind blew a certain way. Some likened it to the smell of death, and it seemed to follow Sowell around.


No one is sure how long Sowell, a registered sex offender who would offer free barbecue to the neighbors, had been living in his three-story house with corpses lying around, many of them black women who had been strangled. Police have now recovered 11 bodies from the home on Imperial Avenue, in the living room, crawl spaces and backyard graves. There was even a skull in the basement.

Full article here.


50 U.N. peacekeepers punished for sex abuses

Nov. 5, 2009 06:18 AM
Associated Press

GENEVA - The United Nations says at least 50 peacekeepers have been punished by national authorities over the last three years for committing sexual abuses on U.N. missions.

The U.N. says the punishments ranged from reduction in military rank to eight months imprisonment.

The data released Thursday comes after repeated requests from media organizations for information on the punishments governments are meting out to peacekeepers accused of rape and other abuses in conflict areas such as Congo.

Full article here.


3 Mexican doctors accused of selling newborns

by E. Eduardo Castillo - Nov. 4, 2009 07:42 PM
Associated Press

MEXICO CITY - Three doctors and a nurse have been arrested for allegedly selling newborns after telling mothers their babies had died at a private hospital in Mexico City, authorities said Wednesday.

Full article here.

Now watch this video.
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Old 11-05-2009, 03:15 PM   #73 (permalink)
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And because of that terrifying encounter with that stranger, she now has a daughter by him to remind her of it the rest of her life.
I hope your niece never gets wind of this sentiment.
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Old 11-05-2009, 03:57 PM   #74 (permalink)
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Oh, she learned long ago about her 'daddy'. I think she might hate him as much as her mom does. He doesn't seem to come around, for some reason...
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Old 11-05-2009, 04:08 PM   #75 (permalink)
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So this guy was an acquaintance?
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Old 11-05-2009, 05:01 PM   #76 (permalink)
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Not hardly, she was attacked by a stranger. She was honest with her daughter when she was old enough to understand why she didn't see daddy like other kids do.
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Old 11-05-2009, 05:34 PM   #77 (permalink)
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Reports Zap for having a picture that many thought was of him.
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Old 11-05-2009, 05:37 PM   #78 (permalink)
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So one person has shown support for a potentially specious position and you attribute it broadly to "many of you"?

OK, I stand corrected. The fallacy you utilized is named "Guilt by Association".
Perhaps zap was also remembering some of the shoot from the hip philosophy that was being spouted in the gun thread.
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Old 11-05-2009, 05:59 PM   #79 (permalink)
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The legal system is for the protection of the weak and those who are too stupid, too lazy or too inept to put themselves in a position where they can protect themselves against these types of scum.
Respectfully, I disagree. I am not weak, stupid, lazy or inept.

Although I believe that I am ultimately responsible for mine and my daughter's safety, I am a law abiding citizen and do not believe in vigilante tactics.

If I (or my daughter) is in immediate danger, you are darn right I will take all steps necessary to protect us, including squeezing the trigger. But outside of that situation, I leave it in the hands of the law. My passion is fighting for improvement of a system that often does not work, not for taking the law into my own hands.
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Old 11-06-2009, 12:05 AM   #80 (permalink)
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Anyone ever wonder how they could rape themselves so they could know what it's like to be on both sides of the fence without hurting anyone else ?
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