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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 11-17-2009, 10:42 AM
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Sure there are some cases like that John, txshellie, but it is not the majority.

Why do you think we pay more than 50% of our salaries to the state or government in taxes?

If we were fully responsible, we shouldn't pay high percentage taxes.

Perhaps it is because I lived a long time in France where we pay a lot of taxes which justifies our demands, social benefits, wellfare, etc.

If I am paying for something, I am going to get my money's worth.
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 11-17-2009, 10:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Natural Elements View Post
Why do you think we pay more than 50% of our salaries to the state or government in taxes?

If we were fully responsible, we shouldn't pay high percentage taxes.
President Obama just stated that there was so much fraud in our Medicare system that fixing that would pay for health care for everyone.

If that's true, I don't understand why there aren't task forces on the ground correcting this issue - apparently defrauding medicare is a bigger business in Miami than the drug trade.

Do you think that inefficiencies in the government are causing you to pay more than 50% of your wages in taxes rather than the real benefits you receive? Do you think your life would be better with a 20% tax rate and 30% more money available to choose services for yourself.

So, say, if you don't have children, you don't have to pay for someone else's childcare expenses?

Just a thought .......
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Old 11-17-2009, 11:09 AM
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Paying 50% of my wages in taxes is a kind of insurance. If I pay 20% and 30% of the money is available to me, it doesn't mean that with the 30% I can pay for what I need. But if you pay 50% in taxes and you don't have anything, of course is not worth it.
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Old 11-17-2009, 11:18 AM
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President Obama just stated that there was so much fraud in our Medicare system that fixing that would pay for health care for everyone.

If that's true, I don't understand why there aren't task forces on the ground correcting this issue - apparently defrauding medicare is a bigger business in Miami than the drug trade.
Simple: One of the primary beneficiaries of largescale fraud is the campaign coffers of the people that'd be in charge of fixing the problem. Look at the mortgage related scandals and take a look at who was receiving money from Fannie and Freddie, who was getting sweetheart deals on mortgages by lenders like Countrywide, etc.

We have a marked tendency to put hungry coyotes in charge of guarding the chicken coops.
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Old 11-17-2009, 11:26 AM
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Originally Posted by robjones View Post
Simple: One of the primary beneficiaries of largescale fraud is the campaign coffers of the people that'd be in charge of fixing the problem. Look at the mortgage related scandals and take a look at who was receiving money from Fannie and Freddie, who was getting sweetheart deals on mortgages by lenders like Countrywide, etc.

We have a marked tendency to put hungry coyotes in charge of guarding the chicken coops.
They are moving in the right direction:
U.S. Forms Financial Fraud Task Force
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/...Games+GameCore)
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 11-17-2009, 11:30 AM
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To move in the wrong direction they'd have to pass a law making graft the official form of approving legislation. Our Congress is a cesspool.
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Old 11-17-2009, 12:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Natural Elements View Post
Paying 50% of my wages in taxes is a kind of insurance. If I pay 20% and 30% of the money is available to me, it doesn't mean that with the 30% I can pay for what I need. But if you pay 50% in taxes and you don't have anything, of course is not worth it.
If you took $25,000 a year and invested it at 8% (not unreasonable) for 20 years you'd have $1,235,573.00

That's what I call insurance
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 11-17-2009, 12:31 PM
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I found this "experiment" very interesting . . .

Quote:
CNN correspondent Sean Callebs has just finished a long assignment: living on food stamps during all of February. He tracked his experiences on the American Morning blog. This meant no eating out, no food on the run while covering stories and no enjoying king cake and other New Orleans specialties during Mardi Gras.
Eating healthy on a shoestring budget
http://www.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/03/06...mps/index.html

The blog about the experience . . .
http://www.cnn.com/2009/US/01/30/am....odstamps.blog/
 
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Old 11-17-2009, 01:41 PM
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Cricket, to get the food stamps you have some restrictions:
http://www.tennhelp.com/Library/Docu...HowMuch807.pdf

It means if a family make a little over than the amount requirement, you don't have any food stamps.
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Old 11-17-2009, 01:43 PM
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Originally Posted by txshellie View Post
If you took $25,000 a year and invested it at 8% (not unreasonable) for 20 years you'd have $1,235,573.00

That's what I call insurance
On your example you have to wait 20 years to get a decent amount, If you can took $25,000 per year

Think about people making less than $30,000 Household income a year...
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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 11-17-2009, 01:57 PM
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I keep going back to what Rob had to say earlier in this thread. It really comes back to a lot of us needing to evaluate how we define our needs vs. our wants, and truly learning to live within our means. If you are getting 500 channels on your TV but your kids are eating Macaroni & Cheese every night, it might be time to reconsider your priorities.

I don't say this to discount the fact that there ARE people who are hungry in our nation right now, but rather to say we do have the power to make changes in our own lives and to encourage the system (with our votes) to educate those with temporary needs so they can learn to be 100% independent.

I believe that education starts with young children. Please correct me if I am wrong, but statistically a child raised on assistance (not a temporary situation for their parents to get back on their feet) then that child is far more likely to grow up to need long term assistance too, to expect the system to take care of them instead of choosing to take responsibility and control of their own lives.
 
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  #32 (permalink)  
Old 11-17-2009, 02:20 PM
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The responsibility and control of our own lives are disappearing in the modern system mechanism of the society unfortunately.

The power to make changes in our own lives and to encourage the system (with our votes)? Respectfully, what kind of vote? The product is the same only the tag brand change. So what is the alternative?

I have met many people who said: "why should we vote for Ron Paul? He will never be President" It seems like people are too lazy to fight for what they believe anymore?
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old 11-17-2009, 04:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Natural Elements View Post
Cricket, to get the food stamps you have some restrictions:
http://www.tennhelp.com/Library/Docu...HowMuch807.pdf

It means if a family make a little over than the amount requirement, you don't have any food stamps.
I was actually referring to the fact that it is possible to eat healthy with very little money.
 
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  #34 (permalink)  
Old 11-17-2009, 04:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Natural Elements View Post
The responsibility and control of our own lives are disappearing in the modern system mechanism of the society unfortunately.

The power to make changes in our own lives and to encourage the system (with our votes)? Respectfully, what kind of vote? The product is the same only the tag brand change. So what is the alternative?

I have met many people who said: "why should we vote for Ron Paul? He will never be President" It seems like people are too lazy to fight for what they believe anymore?
I am probably not active enough in politics simply because I will not allow it to have a huge impact on my life. Life is just too short. I do dedicate myself to issues I am passionate about, but won't allow it to control the life I live. I choose to focus on living and enjoying every moment I am given . . .

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It is easier to find tranquility in your heart if you live your life by the serenity prayer. Change the things ya can. Forget the things ya can’t change, and make dang sure ya know the difference between the two so ya don’t waste a lot of time. http://www.cricketwalker.com/lessons/
 
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  #35 (permalink)  
Old 11-17-2009, 04:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Natural Elements View Post
On your example you have to wait 20 years to get a decent amount, If you can took $25,000 per year

Think about people making less than $30,000 Household income a year...
I'm thinking about all the people who are out there working hard - perhaps 2 incomes in the family - and in your scenario giving an entire income away each year.

If you start saving one average income at 22 then by 42 you would have a million dollars. My issue is with a system that redistributes wealth in the guise of progress and security.

With incomes less than $30,000 you qualify for medicaid, food stamps and WIC in the US. And you can live on $30,000 a year if you don't load up with car payments, eating out and a TV in every room.

If government takes care of a person's every need, where is the incentive for improvement?

Where does "deserve" have a place in our vocabulary?

One thing we've not mentioned in this discussion is that eliminating the Bush tax cuts (that were so often touted as a tax cut for the "rich") are going to increase the lowest tax bracket from 10% to 15% so I guess they'll have an even harder time putting food on the table when those tax cuts for everyone go away.

Or I guess the mentality is to have government take their money and give it back after keeping 50% of it to run the machine to take it away and give it back.....
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Old 11-17-2009, 05:24 PM
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Cricket and Shellie I understand.

Like I always said and I will say it again: "Politicians are disconnected with the real difficulties of people, and if they use their positions to vote their own agenda before The People, then no wonder why people are so angry"
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  #37 (permalink)  
Old 11-18-2009, 02:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Cricket View Post
For what it's worth, I don't see a single reason for people in the US to go hungry. There are programs out there to prevent this in every class regardless of income.

While out on a photo shoot this weekend, I saw a huge number of homeless people under an overpass. My heart was breaking at the situation. At the same time though, I felt so much pride in our community because there was a church there setting up tables to feed everyone along with another group handing out clothing. My son mentioned to me that they (the churches) are there every day doing what they can to help, along with referring people to local programs that can get them help and back on their feet.

When you compare the hunger statistics in some other countries, we are very blessed here in the US.

This reminds me of a similar topic here at the V7N that I wrote about on my blog . . .
http://www.cricketwalker.com/grace/

I agree with you. There are lots of people specially those in third world country who don't even have food on their plate. We should be more thankful that we have food in our plate, like Pope Benedict XVI said "we should not eat luxurious" because there lots of people in some other parts of the world who almost can't afford to eat.
 
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old 12-02-2009, 10:54 AM
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all cases are different. I feel bad for the kids of some of the people who don't manage their money/foodstamps properly and go hungry. Or they sell their stamps. But others have suffered great tragedies and given up while some have been *******s all their lives and eventually it catches up with them and they have no one left willing to help.

never generalize.
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Old 12-05-2009, 12:53 AM
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not economic crisis some other reasons are also there
 
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