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Old 01-12-2014, 07:24 PM
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What Do You Do When You Can't Find Compromise?

Though this is highly wrapped in political party affiliation I would very much like to make this a non-affiliated discussion about the actual topic and actions rather than the party or parties involved and the political swing a person may be.

The topic is what do you do when there is no compromise in a political discussion or attempt to garner a particular action?

For example several years ago when the medical bill was being designed in the U.S. two sides were attempting to discuss it. One side had the upper hand, both sides had different ideas but that side in control seemingly disregarded the other during the design. Both sides had ill to say about the other...the attempt of both was to make the other the villain.

When you are confronted with a side, be it a larger side or a smaller side that is not willing to sway in either direction about anything how would you handle that?
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Old 01-14-2014, 08:13 PM
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When I was young...... I used to sell Kirby Vacuums. (for a short time)
But, I had a great trainer who said, never discuss religion, politics, and raising children with the prospect. Why? These topics are too close to the heart and are too emotionally charged, hence.

So, it is really not possible to not to identify when you are discussing hot topics. And health care is a very sizzling topic.

It's not just one party got an upper hand, or what not. Both parties are in cahoots. They are POLITICIANS. Their objective is to keep that seat.

If we had a system where congress and the house being filled with volunteer members who had no salary, no perks, and no pension, and BTW, 2 year term limit, then, maybe, we could have people who really care about their constituents. If they did it for the love of art, not for the love of the career.

Ah, who knows. Just ranting.
 
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Old 01-15-2014, 04:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wanttobefreeandhappy View Post
When I was young...... I used to sell Kirby Vacuums. (for a short time)
But, I had a great trainer who said, never discuss religion, politics, and raising children with the prospect. Why? These topics are too close to the heart and are too emotionally charged, hence.

So, it is really not possible to not to identify when you are discussing hot topics. And health care is a very sizzling topic.

It's not just one party got an upper hand, or what not. Both parties are in cahoots. They are POLITICIANS. Their objective is to keep that seat.

If we had a system where congress and the house being filled with volunteer members who had no salary, no perks, and no pension, and BTW, 2 year term limit, then, maybe, we could have people who really care about their constituents. If they did it for the love of art, not for the love of the career.

Ah, who knows. Just ranting.

Very good points...btw I sold Kirby for 5 years back in early 90's...was one of those trainers

The art of politics I think, ideally if we reverted back to the volunteer system and had the term limits it would probably have a great impact...after all people will start by doing those things are right, but when confronted with a choice of doing what is right for others and doing what is right for themselves then they will usually have to practice the self preservation and do what is right for themselves first...i.e. keep their seat when talking about congress...congress being both houses...
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Old 01-15-2014, 04:15 AM
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Politicians everywhere act like school children and they are too busy taking care of themselves to take care of their constituents.
So, I kinda don't care whether they agree with each other or get along because it won't affect me in a positive manner, either way.
If they're getting along nicely, I get screwed. If they're fighting like cats and dogs, I get screwed.
 
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Old 01-15-2014, 04:17 AM
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And, although an interesting idea, limiting salaries or even abolishing salaries altogether isn't going to change things.
If you look closely at where politicians make their money, very little of it comes from public funds.
Most of it comes in the form of bribes, er, I mean, "campaign contributions" from big business and the inevitable cushy job that follows after a politician leaves public office.
Politics and big business have a revolving door and that's where the big money enters politics.
 
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Old 01-15-2014, 04:31 AM
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You have a point Zap, hopefully only to an extent...I would like to think that not all are consumed by money...I actually don't think money is the only motivator but a large amount are motivated by the power...of course money can easily translate to power...

Negotiating with others is an art I think...we have our own house i.e. representatives and senators...they are supposed to negotiate and compromise to come up with whatever they are debating...though it seems it has been quite a while since there was real compromise rather whoever has the majority doing what they want and pissing off the other side...

Though I was wanting the conversation to be a little broader than just that...there are all types of instances...one instant is when countries negotiate...clearly not all of them have the same agenda...some of them are even completely untrustworthy. Lets take for example Iran, Taliban, other groups and countries that will unhesitatingly say whatever it takes to get what they want and then turn around and do whatever they want regardless...how do you negotiate and compromise with that? Should you even try or is it just a futile feel good type of process, or a appease the people type of action?
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Old 01-15-2014, 05:32 AM
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Originally Posted by TechWizard View Post
Lets take for example Iran, Taliban, other groups and countries that will unhesitatingly say whatever it takes to get what they want and then turn around and do whatever they want regardless...how do you negotiate and compromise with that? Should you even try or is it just a futile feel good type of process, or a appease the people type of action?
Kind of off topic for this thread, but we seem to demonize other countries too easily.
Taliban is a different story, but I can't blame Iran for acting in the best interests of Iranians.
We do the same. I think all countries do.
Iran is no more untrustworthy than the US or Canada or the UK.
We don't put all our cards on the table when negotiating. Why should Iran be held to that standard?
We have nuclear weapons while demonizing them for wanting them??? It doesn't make sense.
It wasn't Iran that was trying to get a war started in Syria last year. It was the US and UK.
And the US were trying to blame the Syrian government for chemical weapons attacks that have now proven to come from rebels (terrorists to everyday Syrian citizens, but because they share some of the same goals as the US administration, they're "rebels"???)?
That is the very definition of untrustworthy.

So, let's stop pretending that when it comes to governments, there are good guys and bad guys because I only see bad guys, our own governments included.
Perhaps, if Western nations want other countries to act responsibly and respectably, we should start leading by example.
This is no less disingenuous than Western nations preaching democracy and human rights abroad, while practicing fascism and working to remove people's rights here at home.
We're becoming a laughing stock.
 
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Old 01-15-2014, 06:02 AM
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Returning to the topic.

I believe the legislative branch, the house at least, was designed for the parties to "stand their ground" and every two years the people decide who is right or wrong. The problem is that it no longer works as designed. The incumbents are so entrenched and have so much more money than the challengers. Also people tend to vote on local issues not national ones and how much pork the incumbent brought home.
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Old 01-15-2014, 06:10 AM
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Returning to the topic.

I believe the legislative branch, the house at least, was designed for the parties to "stand their ground" and every two years the people decide who is right or wrong. The problem is that it no longer works as designed. The incumbents are so entrenched and have so much more money than the challengers. Also people tend to vote on local issues not national ones and how much pork the incumbent brought home.
This may start an argument, I hope not, and it does go to party versus party which I wanted to avoid but....

I may be wrong, but it seems to me that since Gore lost in 2000 there has been a great deal more hate, malice, and disdain. It disappeared briefly during 9/11 but as soon as the smoke cleared and there was something else to attack with the same applied...seems it hasn't stopped since
 
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Old 01-15-2014, 06:34 AM
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The powers that be of both parties never want the people to recall that united they can throw the bums out there Divide and conquer or in this Divide and control.
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Old 01-18-2014, 10:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wanttobefreeandhappy View Post
When I was young...... I used to sell Kirby Vacuums. (for a short time)
Quote:
Originally Posted by TechWizard View Post
Very good points...btw I sold Kirby for 5 years back in early 90's...was one of those trainers
That must have sucked.
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