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  #261 (permalink)  
Old 09-03-2007, 03:01 AM
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Um, Jesus told people what is necessary to be a Christian. If you don't follow that, don't pretend to be a Christian. If you have to give money away, as Christ says is right and proper, why not give it the government who'll do most for the poor? I don't think Jesus saw tax breaks for the rich or for corporations as a priority. And at the end of the day, render unto Caesar, right?
Rankenstein, nobody is opposing giving money to the government. Where did I say I oppose that? Christians should be opposed to sending the government in to other peoples' homes with guns and taking their earnings and giving those earning to people who choose not to work, opting instead to watch cartoons and shoot heroin all day.

Or, as a Brit, do you not see the difference between

1. taking $100 out of your own pocket, or

2. putting a gun to your neighbor's head and taking $100 out of his pocket?
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  #262 (permalink)  
Old 09-03-2007, 03:28 AM
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You shouldn't help those who don't help themselves. That's a given.

It's a question of attitude. When I was off work, I didn't take a penny off the state, I lived off my savings. My mum gave me hell for that BTW, she thought I was stupid. When I was down to a couple of months money left, I started half-heartedly mooching for a job. When I was down to a couple of weeks spends left, it took me about three days to get a job. (Actually that reminds me, I was rejected for a job by McDonald's once. I love that.) But, if I actually really needed money off the state I would have no qualms about taking it because I know I have the right attitude about it.

Sadly, we are also fostering a bunch of sad sacks who go through life with their hands held out. But that is the price you have to pay for a system which provides for the truly needy. There are duplicitous scammers in every walk of life, but that doesn't mean they aren't scamming a system that is truly worthy.

Anyway, Jesus would have known there were false beggars in his time - it certainly did not prevent him doing what he did or saying what he said.
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  #263 (permalink)  
Old 09-03-2007, 03:31 AM
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Rank, you are totally missing the point.

Christians give.

Liberals take from others to give - this is not giving, is it?

Is my English that hard to comprehend? Or is it the concept? Why is it that I am failing to communicate the difference between stealing money from other people at gunpoint and giving one's own money of one's own free will?
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  #264 (permalink)  
Old 09-03-2007, 03:35 AM
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  #265 (permalink)  
Old 09-03-2007, 03:41 AM
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For somebody who claims to be a comedian, he's rather boring, no?
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  #266 (permalink)  
Old 09-03-2007, 04:02 AM
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What? Who's taking money at gunpoint? It's called paying taxes. Or are Liberal Commie Pinkos now wandering around taking advantage of good old Conservative-value gun laws to arm themselves so they can target the goodly rich and give money to crack dealers and lazy drop-outs? Do they have a list of all the layabouts they want to sponsor. Where did they get it from? Why isn't this in the news?
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  #267 (permalink)  
Old 09-03-2007, 04:08 AM
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Who's taking money at gunpoint? It's called paying taxes.
Yes, Rank, the poor schmucks are legislating money out of the pocket's of hard working citizens, and you can call it taxes, but it's still money being taken at gunpoint. And not just money. Homes, cars, businesses, and freedom - all of it taken by government, hard working people put in prison, losing everything they worked hard for, so that some welfare mom can sell her food stamps and buy coke.
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  #268 (permalink)  
Old 09-03-2007, 04:35 AM
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Yes, Rank, the poor schmucks are legislating money out of the pocket's of hard working citizens, and you can call it taxes, but it's still money being taken at gunpoint. And not just money. Homes, cars, businesses, and freedom - all of it taken by government, hard working people put in prison, losing everything they worked hard for, so that some welfare mom can sell her food stamps and buy coke.
You're focusing on the negative side too much. Like I say, there are always bad apples, but altruism is the noblest stance. You can't say the system is wrong just because people abuse it. People will abuse anything.
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  #269 (permalink)  
Old 09-03-2007, 04:43 AM
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altruism is the noblest stance
There is neither altruism nor nobility in taking money from other. Much less in taking it away at gunpoint and giving it to a government which will undoubtedly misuse over 75% of it.
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  #270 (permalink)  
Old 09-03-2007, 05:23 AM
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There is neither altruism nor nobility in taking money from other. Much less in taking it away at gunpoint and giving it to a government which will undoubtedly misuse over 75% of it.
From where I'm looking at it, POLITICIANS misuse tax money and it doesn't make much difference which side of the political spectrum they are labelled, misuse of tax money is universal in politics all over the world in my opinion.
 
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  #271 (permalink)  
Old 09-03-2007, 05:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Rankenstein View Post
Um, Jesus told people what is necessary to be a Christian. If you don't follow that, don't pretend to be a Christian. If you have to give money away, as Christ says is right and proper, why not give it the government who'll do most for the poor? I don't think Jesus saw tax breaks for the rich or for corporations as a priority. And at the end of the day, render unto Caesar, right?
You are kidding me, right

If they gave it to you and I, there would be more chance that it would be used to help the poor than to the government
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  #272 (permalink)  
Old 09-03-2007, 05:57 AM
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Huh, yeah, fair point. Better to give it to me. Oh, you can have some. How are The Needy doing in Chester?

Actually, that might be a good Liberal campaigning platform. "This is Hilary Clinton saying 'Show Me The Money!' "
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  #273 (permalink)  
Old 09-03-2007, 06:08 AM
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From where I'm looking at it, POLITICIANS misuse tax money and it doesn't make much difference which side of the political spectrum they are labelled, misuse of tax money is universal in politics all over the world in my opinion.
Of course they both misuse it. Liberal or Conservative, they misuse. But Conservatives misuse less of it. Liberals want higher tax rates. Many support a 50% ~ 60% tax rate. Conservatives want to lower the tax rate, which in the end results in less misused taxes.
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