Am I spamming? email question

[bMind]

Hello experts,
I am starting a career site that especially target those staffing agencies in my area. I have just found a list of emails with all the business information including the contacts' first and last names on this employment resource site.

Here are my questions:

1. Is it considered as spamming when I start sending personalized emails to the contacts? I am planning to send 10 each day for the next xx days.

2. I have tried fax broadcasting & targeted hits (one of those guaranteed hits you see everywhere) with no luck. What do you personally think is the most effective method to promote a career site?

I thought about offline promotion but then local newspapers usually won't accept your ad because they treat you as their competitor.

I know we have good/experienced people around that would definitely share some ideas with me. Thanks and your answers is greated appreciated.

[awall19]

if they are in a double opt in type list then it is fine, but I would be pretty careful about sending email out to people based on a list you just found.

some of the people may work near one another now and get your emails the same day and talk about it.

most likely nothing would ever come of it, but I am sure it would suck bad if it did.

I am a fail safe sort of wimp though and deffinentally not an email marketing expert.

[yankeeman]

[quote="bMind"]Hello experts,
I am starting a career site that especially target those staffing agencies in my area. I have just found a list of emails with all the business information including the contacts' first and last names on this employment resource site.

You could try picking up the telephone and request permission to send the appropriate contact an e-mail, or, in your first e-mail request
permission to send additional information.

Make sure your complete contact info is included in the e-mail,
so if someone wants to request not to have further e-mail from you, they
can opt-out.

[mjm1905]

If you gather emails without the sources knowledge, I think it is spam. You should read the congressional rulling on the matter. Look over section 1037.
http://www.spamlaws.com/federal/108s877.html

[dave conz]

Make contact personally first. Paint yourself as the goodie. Rather than push your promotion ("our site is the best") ask questions ("what you would like to see on our site?").

When you've won their trust, you will have a much more effective contact database.

[PhilC]

For a creer site ... consider offline promotions ... Newspapers are best ... newspapers want ads because its a revenue source and I don't see how they can see you as a competitor ... anyway, there are a lot of newspapers around ... Don't email unless you know people have personally requested info ... trust me, people will hate you otherwise ...

[yankeeman]

Originally Posted by sfxmystica

For a creer site ... consider offline promotions ... Newspapers are best ... newspapers want ads because its a revenue source and I don't see how they can see you as a competitor ... anyway, there are a lot of newspapers around ... Don't email unless you know people have personally requested info ... trust me, people will hate you otherwise ...

I respectfully disagree. I send an nitial inquiry out to business prospects all the time and have very litle static. Once in a while, you will hit a nerve, but, you cannot please everyone all the time.

If it is done properly, you can send e-mail to businesses.
I addess the e-mail to an individual, company name, just the same
as a busines leter you would send via snail mail.

I include all my contact info, so if, or whatever reason do not want to receive any additioanl e-mail, they can notify me.

General consumer, that's a diferent apple.


BTW: there is no law against sending e-mail.
There are laws against the method of sending.

[bMind]

Originally Posted by yankeeman

BTW: there is no law against sending e-mail.
There are laws against the method of sending.

true.

Here is what I personally think,..If sending out personalized emails is called spamming, then direct mailing is a spam too (except one is being delivered digitally) because they never agree to receive your sales letter in their mail box.

One more thing, if those people do not want others to contact them, they would not have shown their contact information in the first place.

But yes, don't take it too serious, i dont know 'zet' all about email marketing.

Thanks for the valuable info guys and looking for more inputs

[JohnG]

Bmind,

What is spam? The answer depends on whom you ask.

A marketer may say spam is unsolicited bulk email (meaning the email must be sent in bulk and be unsolicited).

Industry Canada will tell you spam is unsolicited commercial email, (which in my view is too narrow a definition, but hey, who am I?)

The consumer or business person? She will likely tell you, any email I don't want and did not ask for.

What ever answer you choose, there are a couple of points to remember:

* You need internet access to send email. Your ISP will have an acceptable use policy (AUP). Before sending any commercial email, you need to check your service provider's AUP to make sure you are not breaking the these terms.

Sympatico:

http://service.sympatico.ca/system/C...eptableUse.cfm

Rogers:

http://www.rogershelp.com/help/conte...ad/pdf/AUP.PDF

Shaw:

https://secure.shaw.ca/policy/Use-Policy.asp

* You are starting a new service. In today's environment, do you want to run the risk of being wrongly labeled?

This is why more and more people are suggesting direct marketing mail either in the form of a post card or a letter is the better way to make first contact.

For more information on e-mail marketing you may wish to read:

Section E4 of the Canadian Marketing Associations code of ethics:

http://www.the-cma.org/consumer/ethics.cfm

The material referenced in the following article:

The FTC Wants To Hear From You
http://www.learnsteps4profit.com/csp.html

And the following thread:

http://www.internet-marketing-resear...topic4635.html

Trusting these comments and references are of value.

Kind regards,

John Glube
Toronto, Canada

[Ferre]

I wouldn't opt for emails at all, people are really fed up with it and most of the receivers will think of you as annoying. Do some research on your target group. Do they have busyness related magazines? advertise in them.

*just my two cents

[pinkfluffybunny]

Hi,

Maybe I can help. Up until Nov. 2003 our company provided email marketing to our clients (millions a day),. We were not in the bulk mail business but it was just another service. We provided. We took the appropriate precautions (creating sites not linked to the client’s primary domain, on a burnable server and with a burnable domain name, used the appropriate tags in the subject line, with unsubscribe, address, phone number, no deceptive sales pitches, etc.)

The rules changed in 2004. Many European countries enacted laws making it illegal to send unsolicited email and have sent delegations to Washington to convince lawmakers to enact stricter laws.

Our decision to stop bulk email services was made, because we know 1 person searching for a companies services is worth more that hundreds of thousands of bulk emails. Search engines and providers have taken a strict view of spammers and there are penalties.

One of our clients with subsidiaries on five continents, collected leads (people signed up to receive free of demonstration services). The leads are collected in a database and available to the appropriate subsidiary.

A portion of these leads were (approx. 25% contained bogus information, Email, phone number, etc).

An manager was able to obtain the database of all leads (thousands) and decided to do his own bulk email marketing campaign, using that unverified list (without regard opt-in). He listed his company’s domain address which was linked to other sites. During our contracted monitoring of the sites, we identified coming traffic from what we believed to be an unauthorized email campaign. We immediately notified a corporate manager and advised we were removing all links to and from the suspected subsidiary. There was of course a small increase in lead and sales. The problem with mailing the list is that some, or perhaps many of the emails were being delivered to addresses that were make up, submitted by people wishing to remain anonymous, but were “somebody’s” email address.

The manager did not inform the CEO of this incident. The results were dramatic and swift. AOL dropped all of sites from placement, Google ranking began to fall and the CEO sent this to all department heads and copied to us.


“Our leads have dropped like the twin towers. This needs to be addressed immediately. I have been told we are not getting even half of what we were getting 4 months ago. The question I need answers to is what is being done to get our name up in the top 3 slots of the major search engines like we did before. WE NEED IMMEDIATE ATTENTION PUT ON THIS

I will await... not a response for why we are not getting leads like before, rather what will be done to get our leads back up like before.”

The point is sending out ten or 100 may not be noticed, But even so, make sure you verify the addresses, and comply with requirements of the laws, for each country you plan on sending to. I’m sorry we have not keep up on the spam laws since early 2004. The US requirements are here: http://www.spamlaws.com/federal/108s877.html . Canadian laws are probably different. Make sure your ISP isn’t going to give you the boot. If it’s only a few hundred chances are you’ll be ok. But why risk it.

[JohnG]

PFB,

Your answer is helpful on two fronts:

* You suggest Google is using its power to hurt those who promote 'spamming.'

* You outline how folks sent unsolicited commercial email in the past and why passage of a law changed the answer for many.

I would have preferred an opt-in law for the US and believe one is necessary for Canada. Why?

Although the consumer considers spam to be any e-mail she does not want and did not ask for, marketers who support the US opt-out regime suggest spam is fraudulent unsolicited commercial email, arguing non-fraudulent unsolicited commercial email is ok.

With the passage of the CSA, it does not define spam or ban the sending of UBE, but merely regulates commercial email.

This means, presuming you can find an email sender with internet access and your message is CSA compliant, you can send unsolicited commercial email.

As a result, we are continuing to see increased volumes of UBE.

Of course, as you point out, in doing this you are spamming, will be labelled a spammer and once your ISP finds out, your ISP will likely shut you down and Google will take a strip off your hide.

Kind regards,

John

P.S. It is for these reasons I strongly recommend people do not send UBE. Affirmative consent is the only way to fly.

John Glube
Toronto, Canada

[LottoMagicZ4941]

Do not fax blast to Florida unless you like paying a $500 fine per fax. A total violation of freedom of speach I know but I would not risk fax blasting at this point. Lotto Magic prohibits us from fax blasting and warned us of the $500 fine as they are based in florida.

As for me I rarely ever read E-mail anymore. I just deleted 25 of 300 ads from my yahoo account.

[yankeeman]

Unsoliciated faxes has been illegal for quite some time.

[LocalMarketingGuy]

You can email who ever you want, as long as you give them a clear opportunity to opt out, and unsub them in 10 business days.

[yankeeman]

Originally Posted by LocalMarketingGuy

You can email who ever you want, as long as you give them a clear opportunity to opt out, and unsub them in 10 business days.

There is more involved in email marketing other than providing the
recipient a method of opting out.

Speak with a qualified consultant.

[LocalMarketingGuy]

List your address ( no po box if using AIM best efforts)

Advertiser in the message must list their address as well ( 3rd party)

From line must be from the initiator(either the list owner or advertiser)

Subject line must not be misleading, and relevant.

Creative must be clear and conspiciously of commercial intent

You have to give the consumer a clear chance to opt out of the
message..and must honor that opt-out in 10 business days

No adult material allowed unless the subject line reads "sexual content"ect..

is that better for you? :wink: I only listed laws, not how to market via email.

**I shouldn't have said you can email anyone if " .........."- when you do something everyday, it seems easier to you than anyone else...

[yankeeman]

The "From" email address must be valid.
No relay sending.

[LocalMarketingGuy]

damn my memory-i knew i forgot something :idea:

[JohnG]

Local marketing guy, you write:

Creative must be clear and conspiciously of commercial intent.

I am not sure what you mean by this statement. Are you refering to the requirement you must give clear and conspicous notice the content is an advertisement or solicitation?

This requirement only exists for those who are sending unsolicited commercial e-mail.

If you are sending affirmative consent commercial e-mail, this rule does not apply. Meaning? Don't want to be sending spam, then you need affirmative consent.

John Glube