Escalation of War In Iraq

[jg_v7n]

I supported the war in Iraq from its inception. My belief was that to remove Saddam Hussein from power was justification in itself, with or without weapons of mass destruction.

However...

1) The WMD issue was a HUGE mistake. Either it was plain fraud, a complete misinterpretation of intelligence or simply it was driven by an alternative motive - that is, the truth lies somewhere in between - the intelligence was interpreted in a way would ensure the end result. The coalition knowingly read between the wrong lines as it were.

2) The strategic military decisions have been a complete failure, all goals of securing peace and democracy have failed.

3) Adding troops or removing them will make no difference, it will simply fail to stop Iraq and the Middle East deciding its our future on the basis of civil and ethnic war. The coalition is simply in the middle and loosing good men and women.

Though I think there is never doubt that the removal of an evil and brutal dictator is never a bad option; I feel ashamed that I supported this war.

I think that coalition leaders need to come to the same conclusion, I'm just very glad that I'm not the one whose decisions cost (are costing) so much.

[IslaScotts]

I never supported the war. But it was said as soon as Bush II got elected that he would pick up where his father left off (the war in Iraq.) This wasn't a coincidence that this was predicted. This is an economic war, it has nothing to do with Saddam and it has nothing to do with democracy. I feel sorry for the people who are sent over to Iraq and Afghanistan, I know a few people who have served time over there. And all of them are against the war.

[Ferre]

Ever heard of Karma? I can predict some real nasty surprises for the USA in the future. America has lost it's credibility all over the world and they'll find out the minute they are going to really need support.

[IslaScotts]

And people wonder why I didn't get upset about 9/11. My husband woke me up and told me about it... and I went back to sleep. I had been suprised it took someone that long to attack america.. while Bush is trying to rule the world.. he has left the usa completely open for attack.

[kristeejo]

Originally Posted by Ferre

Ever heard of Karma? I can predict some real nasty surprises for the USA in the future. America has lost it's credibility all over the world and they'll find out the minute they are going to really need support.

How about replacing "America" with "The American Government" and you won't be so offensive, Ferre.

Most people I know in "America" never supported this war.

[Ferre]

Originally Posted by kristeejo

How about replacing "America" with "The American Government" and you won't be so offensive, Ferre.

Most people I know in "America" never supported this war.

I'm sorry Christie, but 'America' is perceived as such, as in the democracy that America claims to be and bring to the world, governments are the representatives of the people. When America goes to war, it is factually 'The People of The United States of America' by the letter of the law and every single principle of democratic government.

When I would assume, and the rest of the world too, that it is not 'America' invading countries for their resources but an entity named 'The American Government' with no approval of the people, this implicated that 'America' is ruled not by a democratic system but by a dictatorial regime which does not represent 'the people'.

Now what is it?

[Ferre]

Also, before I forget to mention it, it amazes me how Americans wash their hands in innocence when they say 'It wasn't me, it was my government', it's just a way to steer away from the fact that they are just as responcible for their government as any person in any democracy.

Saying that is just a way of denial that they represent 'you'. 'You', generally speaking, don't mind paying less for gass than the rest of the world do you? 'You, is also the one that pays for it, in the end, and reaps the benefits if there are any.

[kristeejo]

For someone who must surely practice at night his writings about America, you sure don't know what the hell you're talking about.

[Ferre]

Me thinks you don't really understand the concept of democracy.

..and it's evening down here.

[South]

I supported the war from the beginning and still feel that it has yielded some very positive things (with unfortunate bloody negatives....as war does). Saddam had to go. He had to.

I think we're foolish, though, to think that any civil government will stand long in that region. We could stay there for 2000 years and it would never stabilize. The mentality of the people won't let it.

[Adelaida]

USA democracy??? USA this war totalitarian capitalism.

All world is afraid of the USA, except for the several countries, I am very glad that I live in one of them.

[StupidScript]

this implicated that 'America' is ruled not by a democratic system but by a dictatorial regime which does not represent 'the people'.

This precisely describes what has happened. Fewer than 11% of 'Americans' approve of the war, and yet our 'duly elected leaders' (don't get me started) have just revealed their plans for escalation. They have nothing to lose, even in a worst-case scenario. Their companies (and it's a list longer than your arm) have been made obscenely wealthy by these excursions at the expense of every single person who 'elected' them (again, whether they were 'elected' at all is still open for debate).

Just because every individual human being who happens to reside on this particular land mass hasn't taken up arms against the dictatorship doesn't mean that they don't despise what has happened to their 'country' at the hands of those blithering, arrogant, selfish, evil agents of destruction.

It is the nature of a democracy to tally the votes of the people in an attempt to put in place a government who will serve at the people's request. Once in office, however, often an entirely different persona emerges, sometimes to the detriment of the nation.

I challenge you to name a single world government that has not, at one time or another, defrauded, abused or otherwise neglected the wishes of the majority of their constituency. You're in Amsterdam, Ferre? Tell us how that government does only precisely what the population at large wants to have done, and that there has never been any graft or selfishness on the part of a few of your elected leaders.

And while you do your research, please remember that if the supreme leader of any democratic government is the one with myopia, it can be exceptionally difficult for all of the others who resent their actions to remove them from office, or to mitigate the power they wield. Such is the nature of a democracy.

For the record, the United States is a "republic", not a true "democracy". And do not underestimate the power of obscene wealth, particularly when it is used in a realm of power, like within the United States government.

Frankly, if a presidential election were held today, that man would no longer be in office, and may be subject to a war crimes trial. But, as you must surely know, that is not the way our democratic process works. At our latest opportunity, we 'Americans' nearly completely replaced the standing government because we did not agree with the directions in which they were taking us. Inertia is a beast, Ferre. Don't taunt us because the years pass so slowly.

[Adelaida]

Originally Posted by StupidScript

For the record, the United States is a "republic", not a true "democracy".

USA this Impire.
Bush this Darth Vader.
"Oil's magnats" this Imperator Palpatine.

Other world - Republica, i princess Leia.

Now show "The Impire strike back", "New Hope" this...

[K22]

I don't know why we are EXPECTED to offer any friggin' solution to the Mideast problems. Just pack up and go home and be done with it. Those nations are big boys after all they carry guns and whack people's heads off. The Mideast is not our child and we are the parents that need to guide them.

This whole war isn't about democracy and doing the right thing. It is all about oil and big business and don't fall for the smoke and mirrors.

Do you know that the Bush family owns the most most super oil tankers of anyone in the world? So who would benefit from a stable Iraq and pumping of oil?

Also Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice sat on the board of Chevron before she joined the Bush White House as National Security Adviser. The company named one of its oil supertankers the SS Condoleezza Rice.

Seriously they think we are stupid.

[Brian]

Originally Posted by Adelaida

USA this Impire.
Bush this Darth Vader.
"Oil's magnats" this Imperator Palpatine.

Other world - Republica, i princess Leia.

Now show "The Impire strike back", "New Hope" this...

I'd rather compare it to the movie Super Troopers where we just get high all the time. At least in my lifestyle.

[South]

Originally Posted by Adelaida

USA this Impire.
Bush this Darth Vader.
"Oil's magnats" this Imperator Palpatine.

Other world - Republica, i princess Leia.

Now show "The Impire strike back", "New Hope" this...

?

[Ferre]

Yeah, blablabla. The American people voted the democrats in who are just as sleazy as the reps and have exactly the same agenda.

I have said it before and repeat it again, Einstein's definition of being stupid goes something like 'doing the same thing over and over again while expecting different results'.

That's typical for the American public, they are too stupid to understand that voting on either one of those parties will not change anything for them or the rest of the world. Even after 40 years of looking at those parties getting more and more corrupted they still don't get it.

That's one of the reasons why 'the American public' is not perceived as very intelligent in the rest of the (western democratic) world, they make themselves look like fools and distract from their own miserable situation with invading other countries. As long as there is a war going on they don't look at their own situation, it's easy to Bash on Saddam while there's a lesser dictator in their own government, it's easy to be a patriot and support your country when it is under 'attack', without that the America public would be a lot more alert to their own situation, which sucks big time when you look at the statistics of poverty, health care, prison population, freedom of the press, etc. When you look at the scale with all those issues the USA is doing very poorly compared to the rest of the (western democratic) world, very poorly.

The USA simply does not deserve the self-proclaimed status of 'police-of-the-world', they are not far from sharing the ranks of third world countries themselves..if it was not for their massive war industry.

The whole world can see that, except for most Americans, if 'most Americans' would really understand we wouldn't be in the sh!t we are in today. (and I say 'we', because they managed to borrow money from us (the rest of the world) to create a massive hatred from the Islamic world against the western democratic countries.

How much more frikkin stupid can it get?

[Brian]

Everyone is stupid, noone wants to admit it though.