Bad John

[Rankenstein]

Originally Posted by John Scott

I think you labor under the somewhat snobbish Liberal belief that humans are products of (victims of) their circumstances, as opposed to highly intelligent animals who are capable of making decisions that determine who they are and how they act.

I didn't know the old saying "The leopard can't change his spots" was a snobbish Liberal mantra

Seriously, I think it's a good idea - you're a cogent and rational fellow and it can only make your arguments stronger.

[John Scott]

Originally Posted by kristeejo

just the reparations one and I just went in there and immediately got a sick feeling in the pit of my stomach.

i like you right now - i fear "debating" with you will make me have to move my bracelet.

You know, most debates are not over principles. The debates reach different conclusions due to different premises. In a logical debate, a premise is either really not "true" or "false". It has a high truth value, or it doesn't have a high truth value.

To illustrate, your argument:

Premise: The emancipated slaves were denied Forty Acres and a Mule.
Premise: If they hadn't been denied Forty Acres and a Mule, they would be financially stable at that time.
Premise: If they had achieved financial stability, their descendants (i.e.,African Americans of today) would also be financially stable.
Conclusion: By denying the emancipated slaves Forty Acres and a Mule, Whites are responsible for the current financial disadvantage suffered by African Americans.

Is this an accurate representation of your argument?

[Atom]

Originally Posted by John Scott

Just a note here. In the past, I've been somewhat of an aggressive debater.

Just because you're right, though, doesn't mean you have to be aggressive about it. So I plan on being nicer, for the next week or so, at least.

The use of psychology is the best aggression.

[John Scott]

Originally Posted by Rankenstein

I didn't know the old saying "The leopard can't change his spots" was a snobbish Liberal mantra

I have a feeling chicgeek's sentiment has nothing to do with leopards, and more to do with the Liberal psychology that "humans are products of their environment".

It's snobbish in that most proponents of that argument imply that the rest of the world is not making choices, and simply falling into choices pre-determined by their surroundings. The speaker, on the other hand, as a highly educated Liberal, is somehow exempt and granted free will.

[kristeejo]

Originally Posted by John Scott

You know, most debates are not over principles. The debates reach different conclusions due to different premises. In a logical debate, a premise is either really not "true" or "false". It has a high truth value, or it doesn't have a high truth value.

To illustrate, your argument:

Premise: The emancipated slaves were denied Forty Acres and a Mule.
Premise: If they hadn't been denied Forty Acres and a Mule, they would be financially stable at that time.
Premise: If they had achieved financial stability, their descendants (i.e.,African Americans of today) would also be financially stable.
Conclusion: By denying the emancipated slaves Forty Acres and a Mule, Whites are responsible for the current financial disadvantage suffered by African Americans.

Is this an accurate representation of your argument?

i kind of find you "cute" today. WTF?

[John Scott]

Originally Posted by kristeejo

i kind of find you "cute" today. WTF?

Today?

I'm always cute.

[chicgeek]

Originally Posted by John Scott

I have a feeling chicgeek's sentiment has nothing to do with leopards, and more to do with the Liberal psychology that "humans are products of their environment".

It's snobbish in that most proponents of that argument imply that the rest of the world is not making choices, and simply falling into choices pre-determined by their surroundings. The speaker, on the other hand, as a highly educated Liberal, is somehow exempt and granted free will.

Your feeling is wrong.

I think it's going to be difficult for you, though not impossible. I think it's a noble challenge to take on, and I wish you luck.

But you're already turning it into an arguement, so I wonder whose point this proves... I once again withdraw myself from this subforum.

[John Scott]

But you're already turning it into an arguement

I didn't say that I wasn't going to argue. I believe argument is not only good, but it is an obligation of the human species to argue. To not argue to is neglect our intellects and shirk our responsibility to discover the truth.

I simply stated that I would be more, um, nicer. Just because somebody expresses an idea that is worthy of ridicule doesn't mean that the person expressing it is worthy of ridicule.

[chicgeek]

You haven't changed a bit. I don't know why I expected you to.

[Cricket]

[John Scott]

Originally Posted by chicgeek

You haven't changed a bit. I don't know why I expected you to.

In the absence of a compelling reason not to, I think I'll take this as a compliment.

[cldnails]

Originally Posted by Bernard

Confucious said:

"For one word a man is often deemed to be wise, and for one word he is often deemed to be foolish. We should be careful indeed what we say."

I thought he said "Man who buys drowned cat pay for wet pussy."

Anyways, John I submit that you are not being nicer, just being more creative with your insults.

[StrongInTheArm]

Scientist Richard Dawkins, an atheist known worldwide for arguing against the existence of God, has described himself as a "cultural Christian".

Prof Dawkins, who has frequently spoken out against creationism and religious fundamentalism, replied: "I'm not one of those who wants to stop Christian traditions.

"This is historically a Christian country. I'm a cultural Christian in the same way many of my friends call themselves cultural Jews or cultural Muslims.

"So, yes, I like singing Carols along with everybody else. I'm not one of those who wants to purge our society of our Christian history.


http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7136682.stm

John: How is the new leaf working out?

[John Scott]

Originally Posted by cldnails

Anyways, John I submit that you are not being nicer, just being more creative with your insults.

Really? You have a post you can show me. In policing myself, I feel I've been a good boy, and fully expect to find Christmas presents under the tree on the 25th.

[cldnails]

Originally Posted by John Scott

Really? You have a post you can show me. In policing myself, I feel I've been a good boy, and fully expect to find Christmas presents under the tree on the 25th.

You know John, I was looking back through your posts and you are showing restraint! Why did you feel you needed to police in the first place?