Is government intervention justified?

[m42]

Scenario: A child is dying of a common and very treatable condition. Instead of seeking treatment, the parents of the child put their faith in God and pray for the child's recovery.

Should the government intervene?

The child dies.

Should the government intervene?

What are your thoughts?

[South]

I may be wrong, but aren't there laws now that prohibit parents from denying medical attention to a child who needs it?

Otherwise I not really sure how the government intervenes if the parents aren't breaking the law. It's a tough call. On one side you hate to see a child suffer, but giving government intrusion rights into families is a dangerous, dangerous road.

OK, turns out that I don't know how I feel about this. I'll go think about it. Surely there's a solution that protects kids and doesn't allow government into family affairs.

[Harveyj]

How is this sort of neglect and abuse any different from beating a child?
And I don't mean a smack on the arse, I mean something that's gonna leave a bruise or 12.

Believing that God is going to cure your child just by praying is something for the naive or the brainwashed. I'm not religious, I wasn't even raised under a christian faith, but even I know that the Torah, Bible and Quran all say that God helps those that help themselves.
As in "Help yourself & your family to some medical treatment, moron!"

[South]

Originally Posted by Harveyj

but even I know that the Torah, Bible and Quran all say that God helps those that help themselves.

I actually don't think it says that.

The problem is dogma. I've seen prayer do some amazing things beyond the scope of man...even heal the un-healable, but if treatment is within the scope of man.....?

A person obviously should do what's in the best interest of the child. The question is whether the government should intervene in the family decision. That's where it becomes a tough call.

[G10]

Originally Posted by Harveyj

How is this sort of neglect and abuse any different from beating a child?
And I don't mean a smack on the arse, I mean something that's gonna leave a bruise or 12.

Believing that God is going to cure your child just by praying is something for the naive or the brainwashed. I'm not religious, I wasn't even raised under a christian faith, but even I know that the Torah, Bible and Quran all say that God helps those that help themselves.
As in "Help yourself & your family to some medical treatment, moron!"

I think what your thinking of is the scripture that mentions "Faith without works is dead"

Thing is, as South says, it is a tough call and we do not have the right to judge someone else's situation without being in it first.

That said, I personally do not believe in faith healing per say, though I do think that prayer has some power to help.

[EBORG9]

Why wouldn't they believe in Christian doctors ? Or that God created the cure for the disease ? Or that God sent the cure in the form of the doctor ?

I never understand that kind of thinking. Believe in some things created by God, yet not others.
If you truly believe that your God is all knowing and nothing would exist without him, then why wouldn't you believe in everything ?

I believe the government should interview..obviously people who would do that are not thinking clearly,, and the principle that they would ignore the cure or treatment, and instead wait for the hand of God to create miracle, proves that they are not as religious as they claim, because they would believe that the treatment exists because God willed it.

[D3n!ss3_gÜrL]

I think I've read this somewhere in a book.

Well, like what South said, if it falls under prohibition of the law, then the government can intervene.

Basically that is what Social Welfare Department is for. There are cases like these that parents deny their children the necessary medical support due to some reasons ... (which I could understand if that's financial one)

but because of religion? now, that's BS!

A parent should draw a line between deep faith and when to act as a real parent!

[G10]

Originally Posted by D3n!ss3_gÜrL

A parent should draw a line between deep faith and when to act as a real parent!

ehm, I think that is what 'deep faith' is.... To put your entire trust in something (be it God or whatever it is one follows)

If one has faith in something then no matter what, that belief is going to be manifest throughout whatever is going on in that persons life.

I am not saying it is right or wrong as it is not for me to judge another.

[Gloria1]

Originally Posted by m42

Scenario: A child is dying of a common and very treatable condition. Instead of seeking treatment, the parents of the child put their faith in God and pray for the child's recovery.

Should the government intervene?

The child dies.

Should the government intervene?

What are your thoughts?

well, this doesn't make sense to me and i think the parents deserve some punishment in one form or the other. God said in the Bible that we should eat the fruits and use the leaves to cure diseases. God did not say we should use prayers to cure diseases but rather said we should use the leaves of the plants He God has created to cure diseases. you can check from your Bible.

[G10]

^Yes god did say that but synthesized drugs are as far from natural as you can get and the bible doesn't mention that

You see, when you synthesize a drug, you are taking it away from it's natural form and most companies do this for patent reasons and the problem with this is that the body has no defences to this and sees the synthesized drug as an attack on itself so most drugs have to be potent enough to knock that part of the defence system hard enough so that it can't fight it.

Nothing natural about most cures.

That said, I do not agree to trying to use faith to cure illnesses, diseases or aflictions as the reality of it is that it doesn't work and this is very easy for one to prove.

[Gloria1]

Yes you are right G10 but what i am trying to say here is that we shouldn't depend on prayers but rather seek medical attention where necessary. It is good to pray for the sick but i think after taking his or her medication..

[olman]

I don't remember the details of the case, but I think that they're referring to that recent event in the news in which the young girl ended up dying of an easily treatable illness.
Me, I'm fine with Adults refusing medical care- that's their choice. But I believe that they owe proper medical care to the Children.
Yes, I believe in God, and I believe that God does miracles. However, I also believe that there is no problem with using modern medical science to stay well.
I believe, if I recall, that the home Church of this family was strongly opposed to medicine.
Clearly, there's significant issues with Government interference in Religious matters, but where does it stop? How is this different than a Satanic cult practicing human sacrifice?

[thegamerslink]

Originally Posted by G10

^Yes god did say that but synthesized drugs are as far from natural as you can get and the bible doesn't mention that

You see, when you synthesize a drug, you are taking it away from it's natural form and most companies do this for patent reasons and the problem with this is that the body has no defences to this and sees the synthesized drug as an attack on itself so most drugs have to be potent enough to knock that part of the defence system hard enough so that it can't fight it.

Nothing natural about most cures.

That said, I do not agree to trying to use faith to cure illnesses, diseases or aflictions as the reality of it is that it doesn't work and this is very easy for one to prove.

How do we know if it's natural or not? What is natural in a biblical sense? Could not anything that we are allowed to discover that helps us be arguably considered a gift from God?

[G10]

Originally Posted by thegamerslink

How do we know if it's natural or not? What is natural in a biblical sense? Could not anything that we are allowed to discover that helps us be arguably considered a gift from God?

I understand what you mean and everything provided on this planet (if one believes in God) could be classed as natural.

I can only imagine a gift from God to be something that helps mankind and he requires nothing for it.

When man synthesizes a drug so that it can be patented and not used by other companies, it is like taking the gift, making a clone copy of it with a slightly different structure that ones body does not recognise and for the sole purpose of making money.

I have friends that work for pharmaceuticals and they themselves admit that drugs are taken away from a natural process for monetary reasons.

The body is intelligent and can cope with almost all natural substances but take them away from their natural state and see what happens.

Example, radiation, this can be made by man and one could class it as natural but see how ones body copes with fighting this off.

Everything is originally natural, it is what we do with it that counts.

[thegamerslink]

Originally Posted by G10

Everything is originally natural, it is what we do with it that counts.

That I agree with whole heartedly