SEO :: The Game and the Claims!

Abhishek · 06-01-2006, 08:03 AM

A couple of days ago, I had a meeting with a client located in my city, an advertising firm, that recently re-designed it's website with many frontend and backend changes and was looking in for opportunities to setup it's presence in the Online market!
Since, I have earlier worked on SEO for some local biggies, they somehow got my name and I was called in for a short meeting-cum-interview!
I wasn't introduced to this project while it was still being planned, its been 2 months since the new website came up, when I was called in.
Being the advertising oriented people that they are, they had their website full of highprofile flash, irritating splash page with images that were super high in terms of size!
Now as most of the companies believe, SEO should be done once the website is done, as in this case. But I strongly belive and also that if SEOs are introduced while the site is still under construction things get better!
Now, in the 3 hours of meeting and about 7 cups of coffee that we had, I spoke to them atleast 20 times that we need to work on text and that directory submissions/article submissions and backlinks alone cannot do them any good! Onsite optimisation is required and any normal SEO would require that space wherein he can exercise his onsite SEO skills!
Now being in the SEO industry for about 20 months, and having met a little over a 100 clients and done projects for about 80 of them. I sure can say that many website owners with websites which are either new or have been re-designed by designers who isn't aware of SEO, get all that red and fiery, when you tell them, that their design which they though was perfect is nothing but a bland page that unfortunately has incorporated many such elements that prove as a hindrance in the way of Search Engine Spiders, and that the site may require a major overhaul in order for it to be able to rank well with Search Engines!
So here with this client, I ask him to give me sometime for keyword research, I come back to my place, do a bit of research work, keyword popularity research! Check out his competitor's website, see what they are using and what they are losing! and finally decide on 3 keywords that I find will be the best for them, I give them to him and ask him , what he thinks!
He reverts back immediately with the keyword "Indian Advertising Agency",
and says he wants to rank top on Yahoo/MSN and Google for this keyword and that too within 2 months! I explained to him thats it's practically impossible to get to this rank with such competition, since SEs generally require quality content and that your content must be really good in the field!
Whereas in this case, there was practically none.
From this looks though, he appeared to be understanding what I was saying, since I feel I explain really good. But still I asked him to keep me updated about what's happening!
Now in the times, when you are just about to convince the clients what's happening with his site, and what should be done, there jumps in those idiots who can do nothing but make claims!
Today in the morning,I receive an email from him and he feels quite cheered,
He proudly states that finally he has managed to find an SEO who is able to cater to all his needs and fits well in his pocket and that he "assured top rankings in 2 months"
He quotes the other person's email ...

Quote:

Hi,
We want to ofeer you our one way optimized links package for your site. All links will come from content optimized pages, meaning more weight for the search engines.
More than 80% of the links will have your desired anchor text(link).
We will achive this results by distributing an great optimized article on more then 400 sites, all links will come from diff IP's.
Each article posted will have 2 one way links pointing to your site.
What are the advantages of links from optimized articles?
These days all webmasters and online marketers prefer one way links and not reciprocal or directories links because of several reasons:
1. All the resulting links will be placed in the context of a optimized content page, not in links pages with no surrounding content.
2. After one initial payment (We accept only egold) you will not pay one cent in the future but all the links will stay live and even more, links will start to multiply because of webmasters that will repost your article on their websites along with your 2 one way links.
3. These one way links both deliver targeted traffic and improve your link popularity and search engine rankings.
In order to receive maximum search engine benefits from these one way links we will integrate your desired keyphrases in both the title of the article and body.
This is the exact same method the bigger SEOs use to achive high rankings for our own sites.
In less than 10 days we will send you a detailed report so you can check all the live links.
Don't worry about bad tricks or ffa, this mehod is tested and improoved by us along the years and it is more than legitimate.
Quick Overview:
We will write an optimized article, attache 2 one way links to your site with it and we will submit it to more then 450 sites.
After a campaign with just one article our clients end up with aprox. 600 one way links to their sites, because our writers are recognized on the internet and have a high approval rate for the articles.
This method will achieve top rankings for you on almost any keyword out there within 45 days and we provide a 200% assurance on that.
If you want to know more or you want us to start, let's discuss all the details here.
Waiting for your reply,
XXXXXX

Check out the claims and their spellings show how professional they are isn't it ??

Abhishek

MrMean · 06-01-2006, 10:30 AM

What can I say besides amusing. Your client will learn, the hard way. It amazes me how these people get into the position of taking on an SEO. If they are that dumb in the first place.

vangogh · 06-01-2006, 10:36 AM

All you can do is laugh. Unless you want to drive yourself crazy. Abishek I'm sure you already feel this way, but this was a client you're better off without. It was unlikely you would have ever gotten anything more than headaches.

Some people just don't want to see that online marketing isn't about magic formulas and that they might actually have to build a good site and then spend the time to promote it in a way that ties in with what their business is about.

Abhishek · 06-01-2006, 10:37 AM

Am waiting for that, but seriously if given my way, this client must have benefitted a lot!
Not that I'd die, if I don't get this project, but that I really wanted to do this!
A staunch competitor of mine is handling his rivals project and my client himself is going the wrong way!
The agency is quite a known one down here!
Look at the idiot's demands, they demand Non Chargebackable Egold! and ask the client to pay upfront!
Abhishek

vangogh · 06-01-2006, 11:12 AM

It's sad that so many businesses fall for this kind of thing. There are so many warning signs in the email, but still when people are promised instant results without having to do any work they fall into the trap over and over.

MagicYoyo · 06-07-2006, 01:12 AM

Maybe the client send you their email for you to analyse their offer.

What I would do, with zero agressiveness :
First, ask a question :
"Aren't you affaraid with dealing with them ?
Don't you think their method... ? What do you think about Google's attitude towards these methods ? What about their strange way of dealing ? their promise for something they don't rule ? Where are their former customers ?"

Then, you can say something like that : "I strongly believe they will spend your time or money for nothing. Moreover, they practices are risky for you..."

End with : "Your choice is, inefective, rough & risky SEO for cheap, or sound skills, proven experience, high ambition for a high ROI investment ?"

MagicYoyo · 06-07-2006, 08:42 AM

[sorry for the bump]

I'm really interested in tracking this case. Please Abhishek, post evolution here.

Abhishek · 06-07-2006, 09:11 AM

Hey Magicyoyo,
The fact is, I don't think it sounds good to talk to a client like that!
I somehow feel that this makes me sound small!
Imagine you sell antiques and you're contacted by a client who wants a rare portrait which has a market price of 5000 USD and you tell the client that it will take you all the blah blah import duties and all and you will charge him 5500$ for the same!
Now the client finds another antique dealer! who says that he can get him the same portrait for a 1000$, the client dumps you and goes for him!
Will you tell your client that ?
Aren't you affaraid with dealing with them ?
Don't you think their method... ? What do you think about the market's attitude towards these methods ? What about their strange way of dealing ? their promise for something they don't rule ? Where are their former customers ?
I strongly believe they will spend your time or money for nothing. Moreover, they practices are risky for you...
What if the client speaks about this attitude in the market?
This was just one mail I was shown though! The client must have definitely told him about me and my budget plan! Am not aware of their answers ?
So it's better .. let him learn the hard way!
Abhishek

MrMean · 10-05-2006, 12:01 AM

Isn't it about providing a good honest service?

I would be completely straight with my clients/friends/business associates. I would pull them to one side and just point out that you know its none of your business but you think there making a mistake. From this you might have upset them, but they will learn the lesson them selves and probably come back to you.

Manish Pandey · 10-05-2006, 04:52 PM

It happens... abhi... I have had similar situations quite a lot of times... but then when I lose one... I just say... OK NEXT...

Cheer up!

A.N.Onym · 10-05-2006, 10:48 PM

I'd too tell the client where they are going with the cheap services. It is simply a matter of providing quality service. Sometimes, clients don't want quality, because they don't know much.

Even if they do get those article links, their site will be dead for the customers and the search engines.

Show your client this thread, even if he isn't using your services

aryo · 10-06-2006, 04:46 AM

i agree with simply letting your client know that accessibilty, usability, and relevance of content goes above backlinks and such. maybe back it up with evidence to at least get the point across. that way if or when they come back to you in 2 months and realize that they made a bad choice you can enjoy the look on his face and satisfyingly say "i told you so" (in your head of course), and move on.

aryo · 10-06-2006, 05:03 AM

but i do agree with you in that people should start incorporating SEO into the design cycle of creating a website. makes it so much easier for us and them in the long run.

vangogh · 10-10-2006, 10:04 AM

Abhishek sometimes I think all you can do is explain why what you're offering is of value and then leave it up to them to make the decision. I know it sucks to lose a client you think will bring in revenue, but some clients aren't worth the money. This one would probably be a constant struggle and in the end you could easily spend more time trying to get them to understand what is the right approach only to have them go another route and blaming you when their way didn't work out.

I think you handles things well and it's just a case of this client not seeing the value of your services. You can try to help people understand why you offer value, but there's only so much you can do if they won't listen.

A.N.Onym · 10-10-2006, 05:48 PM

There is a saying:
"Those that can understand, don't need an explanation. Those that can't, won't understand you anyway".

So basically, as vangogh said, you explain why you'd be the right choice for them and leave the decision for them. If they make it, good. If not, you saved yourself from a pita.

vangogh · 10-12-2006, 05:00 PM

A.N. Onym brings up an interesting point.

As good as this client may seem to be the time you spend worrying about what it can take to land them as a client might simply be better spent landing another client. You may even find in that time you can land 2 clients each of whom might be just as good if not better for your business.