Latent Semantic Optimization & Indexing

peterko · 04-03-2008, 01:24 PM

I've already heard about Latent Semantic Optimization (LSO) and Latent Semantic Indexing (LSI). I found a lot of useful information about it, and it seams to me I understend the importance, and more or less understand how it works. But I still feel kind of overcrowded with this disorderly accumulated information.

When it comes to apply that knowledge to optimize my website in particular, then I feel like I've done not enough, and I see my SERP beyond my expectation.

May be I have such poor results because I did everything manually, just using some AdWords research and Keywords Density tools, and I couldn't find any SPECIAL Latent Semantic Optimization tool which would finally look at my site and say something like that "Your site is Latent Semantic Friendly" or "Your site is not Latent Semantic Friendly, because your content has such & such things to fix"

Does anyone know some Latent Semantic Tool that might generally look at my site with certain recomendation to fix it, so it would follow Latent Semantic Concepts.

A would very appreciate any suggestions.

Have a great day

Filepeter · 04-04-2008, 01:10 PM

Well if you already had introduced yourself to the theory, and learned it well, you have done half of the work. Knowing the benefits of having content optimized with Latent Semantic Optimization will already push you one chest ahead infront of your competitors. But how really to do things for real? There are certain articles about the formulas of Latent Semantic Indexing, if you study them a bit, you may get this done alone, but I doubt the results will be as satisfying as you would want them to be.

So, regarding your question on a tool about Latent Semantic Optimization, I only know one, not sure if I can post direct link to it, it's called LSOtool, and the site is lsotool.com, hope it helps.

Good luck.

Filepeter · 04-04-2008, 01:21 PM

I forgot to say that, the tool is not actually showing you if your site is friendly or not friendly to Latent Semantic Optimization process, it makes it friendly. Actually there is no such thing as LSO friendly or LSO not friendly site, it's either LSO optimized site, or not LSO optimized, I mean.. it's not like some typical code etc.

peterko · 04-05-2008, 05:20 PM

Thanks for your reply, Filepeter
I was trying to find LSOtool download from the site lsotool.com, but I couldn't find it. Do I have to register first in order to get access to the certain features of that site, or anything else? Please help me to figure it out.

Have a great day

Filepeter · 04-07-2008, 11:17 AM

You probably have to register at lsotool to gain accesss to it, but as far as I know it's a paid tool, but it seems one of the few ways to optimize your content via Latent Semantic Optimization for the average person. I'll look for more info and tell you.

peterko · 04-07-2008, 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Filepeter

You probably have to register at lsotool to gain accesss to it, but as far as I know it's a paid tool, but it seems one of the few ways to optimize your content via Latent Semantic Optimization for the average person. I'll look for more info and tell you.

Thanks for you feedback, Filepeter
As far as I see, you personally didn't use that tool, but anyway I really appreciate your efforts to help me out. When you get more info, please let me know. Looking forward to hear from you soon. Thanks again.

Have a great day

Filepeter · 04-10-2008, 02:02 PM

Ok, I contacted for more information, it's 92 euro for a single research on certain search term. It seems the cost of the researching is high, because the tool it self is probably working as a search engine to extract the ContentDNA of the internet.

It's maybe a lot for the average people, but the high competitive websites are ready to pay even more for having the pleasure of using such and be in top 10.

Hope this helps.

peterko · 04-10-2008, 05:47 PM

92 euro for a single research on certain search term, it's really too much, I guess even for high competitive websites, especially when the relults are not 100% guarantee (I mean real guarantee). Honestly, I wouldn't risk such money for dealing with unknown company. I don't think the company you are talking about is well-known which can 100% guarantee the results, (I guess it's not Google with it's Latent Semantic Tool).

I'm curious, if the Latent Semantic Optimization and Indexing are so important to raise website status, why there is so small number of special tools developped as of now? I guess that most of webmasters would like to use them. It looks like no one really knows how to make those tools work properly, because they have to apply Google technology and algorythm, which is really a secret, don't you think so. IMO

Have a great day,

Barr · 04-10-2008, 06:07 PM

Hello there peterko, I have came here while browsing my fellow google. It seems like Mr. Filepeter, whom nickname comes from the british tv series IT Crowd I believe, has scared you quite a bit.

Latent Semantic Optimization is slowly popularizing, think of it as a "car". When they invented the cars, only few people knew it. When they started to make them for the public, only few people had them. But slowly, by seeing your neighbor having this brand new Ford at the times, you would like to have it too, sooner or later.. you see yourself with this car. Then your other neighbor saw you got a car also, and told to himself: "Hey, why my neighbor can have this.. thing, and I cannot?", and bought one car for him self also.

Slowly with the years, car reached a phase where we cannot live without them, if all the cars in the world dissapear with a single "clap!", imagine what mess would raise?

It is just the same with the semantic future of the search engines, not many heard about it, not many talk about it, and not many (yet) want to realize it even if they heard about it? Why, cause this is going to ruin everything they know, this is going to ruin the bicycle they had before they buy the new "car". So, it's just about time for the SEO universe to popularize the semantic ways of optimization. If you ask for my opinion, I see the future there, actually it's already present, but partially.

Regarding this tool, or any other. Regarding any company out there, any.. similar service, have you ever heard of anything 100% guaranteed? Is any SEO technique 100% successeful at all? I think not, it never was, and it will never be. However, we do know most of them work right? And it depends on us if the success is going to be 50 or 99%, cause there is never 100%, never for anything there is 100%.

So again, about this tool, it's maybe much for the average person to spend so much money for optimizing for a single search term, but as Filepeter said, every high-competitive site is going or it's already using this method to optimize its content. And by saying this is much even about them, this is simply not true, the world is actually based on marketing, we live from marketing, we feed from marketing, everything is there.. even in the internet. And you can't imagine for the sums that are spend by the giant to promote or improve something, you can't imagine how much the big companies pay just to form a group of random people and ask them for their opinion, knows as "focus" groups, you have no idea how many people are studying their behaviour and being paid for this. Or maybe you have idea, but I'm just reminding.

At the moment this is the one and only tool for Latent Semantic Optimization, and if you have read the big article ( I think you did ), you will know that to extract the ContentDNA for a search term is not an easy job. It requires a playground, it requires.. something like a mini-search engine, to extract the ContentDNA of the million sites. The tool has been developped for ages, the model was studied and build for years of work also, you can read more on the theory site, the article by David De Bock.

So believe it or not, this will slowly become a standard within the next years. And the decission of buying this new "car", or going out with your old bicycle is still yours. Right?

P.S. The most important thing is not the tool at this moment, but spreading the knowledge and importance of the semantic web, and semantic optimization (Latent Semantic Optimization, knows also as LSO).

Filepeter · 04-10-2008, 06:16 PM

I could not say it better my self. But regarding on the question how are they building such tools, I'm afraid I cannot answer. But, Matt has announced they are testing LSI a few years ago, probably not much than two years.

You should know that LSI or LSA are not anything new. This is very, very old. LSI's patent dates from 1988, and it had nothing to do with google.

Latent semantic analysis (LSA) is a technique in natural language processing, in particular in vectorial semantics, of analyzing relationships between a set of documents and the terms they contain by producing a set of concepts related to the documents and terms. LSA was patented in 1988 (US Patent 4,839,853) by Scott Deerwester, Susan Dumais, George Furnas, Richard Harshman, Thomas Landauer, Karen Lochbaum and Lynn Streeter. In the context of its application to information retrieval, it is sometimes called latent semantic indexing (LSI).

Additionally, take a look here:

Quote:

Regular keyword searches approach a document collection with a kind of accountant mentality: a document contains a given word or it doesn't, with no middle ground. We create a result set by looking through each document in turn for certain keywords and phrases, tossing aside any documents that don't contain them, and ordering the rest based on some ranking system. Each document stands alone in judgement before the search algorithm - there is no interdependence of any kind between documents, which are evaluated solely on their contents.

Latent semantic indexing adds an important step to the document indexing process. In addition to recording which keywords a document contains, the method examines the document collection as a whole, to see which other documents contain some of those same words. LSI considers documents that have many words in common to be semantically close, and ones with few words in common to be semantically distant. This simple method correlates surprisingly well with how a human being, looking at content, might classify a document collection. Although the LSI algorithm doesn't understand anything about what the words mean, the patterns it notices can make it seem astonishingly intelligent.

When you search an LSI-indexed database, the search engine looks at similarity values it has calculated for every content word, and returns the documents that it thinks best fit the query. Because two documents may be semantically very close even if they do not share a particular keyword, LSI does not require an exact match to return useful results. Where a plain keyword search will fail if there is no exact match, LSI will often return relevant documents that don't contain the keyword at all.

Barr · 04-13-2008, 02:21 AM

Well LSI is old thing, as you said, it's not used in his pure variant in Latent Semantic Optimization. The new thing is that search engines are using a modified version of LSI and LSA to research, they call it Latent Semantic Indexing model of The Second Generation, it's slightly different but the idea is the same.

ezhel · 04-16-2008, 01:53 AM

i have heard a lot from this but I didn't try...

Filepeter · 04-16-2008, 07:59 AM

You have heard alot about Latent Semantic Optimization, but you haven't tried? What stops you from it?

Its like running away from the good results.

peterko · 04-21-2008, 07:22 AM

Uhh, I was trying to implement that logic from Latent Semantic but it's really really not easy process, especially when no one can say if I'm correct with my optimisation efforts, and I can't see the results right away.
That's why I was wondering if there are any tools around, which can analyze my site, comming up with cirtain suggestions, otherwise it will take very long time of blur efforts and I have know idea whether my site will ever meet Googles Latent Semantic requirements.
If someone might take a look at my site saying if I'm on a right track, any help would be greatly appreciated.

Have a wonderful day

Humak · 04-23-2008, 11:05 PM

I am facing the same problem here, while learning about the LSI.

shoaeeb · 07-18-2008, 03:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barr

Well LSI is old thing, as you said, it's not used in his pure variant in Latent Semantic Optimization. The new thing is that search engines are using a modified version of LSI and LSA to research, they call it Latent Semantic Indexing model of The Second Generation, it's slightly different but the idea is the same.

Agree here with u.