How I deal with a non-paying client

alexavrutin · 04-25-2006, 02:22 PM

Hope this will be interesting for those doing freelance work...

Recently we were asked to design an e-commerce website (not all but the e-commerce part and design). We've done, and the client did approve the work. However we did not hear from them since then (I confirm that they are alive). Eventually I've got tired emailing, faxing and waiting and decided to try another method ("Public shame" as I called it).

I have created a simple web page with our view of the issue (~1 hour) and put it on-line. Since the client's name was SemiCentral.com I registered the domain name www.semicentral-warning.com ($8.95 for the domain name at GoDaddy, hosted on our server so the hosting is free). Note that the name of the client's site appears as a full word on the domain name -- this is important for better ranking on search engines.

I have submitted the site to the major search engines (Google, Yahoo, MSN -- free) plus dozens smaller search engines automatically via TrafficBlazer ($19.95). Together with a couple of basic SEO techniques I expect the site to get ranked quite high when searching for "SemiCentral" and hopefully a couple of client's business domain terms, too.

After the site appears in search engines I am going to let the client know of this site and suggest that they follow the instructions on the site for their own good.

Any comments?

kyleposey · 04-26-2006, 05:10 AM

Yeah, that's called blackmail, and its putting you on the same level as them.

Being a freelancer & businessman, you will find that occasionally clients suck. Sometimes they will stiff you, sometimes they will be a pain, and sometimes they will make you ashamed to put your name on their project. I doubt there is really a way to eliminate those types of clients, but there are ways to reduce. Require a deposit... If you have trouble getting stiffed, start requiring half up front. Then at the very worst, you get paid half.

maxim · 05-02-2006, 05:38 PM

Hiya..this is my first post for about over a year by the way. so you are really blessed..yeah right

I feel for you as im in the same position with an important client of mine at the moment.
I have/had good working relationship with this client for years litterally but with only smaller jobs that needed doing. Until about 3 months ago when they asked me to quote them for much larger works, which i did and then they asked me to carry them out; which i did and by the way it was a sterling job even if i do say so myself and they were really happy with it. Anyway i also had to hire a contractor for 2 days to carry out the work. SO im already out of pocket there.

Now its officially been 38 days since i completed the work although it has been longer i didnt chose to invoice them until i was satisified it was all working as it should be. this is normal practice for me. so over a month now and im starting to get annoyed and contacting them going to see them and yesterday hand delivering a 'final inovice' to the 'main man' stating it had to be paid within 3 days.
But he hardly really acknowldged me and dodged my questions so did everyone else giving me BS and being really shady but all around me they are spending money. they are just trying there luck.

so to come back to your question i do think you have been hasty in putting up a hate site. not even goverment or local authorities do 'naming and shaming' until they are really desperate. so neither should we. Infact i have done it beofore on this forum in regards to a crappy online directory that owed me money. but they were really shitty and it did make them give me my money back

(steps to take as follows)

anyway i have now taken all reasonabe steps to inform the customer that they are way overdue ( i trust you have done this to? )

next step is to go down there (after my holiday as im on a break at the moment) and sit in their reception talking to people and being really overly nice (i find this works allot for me).
Then get on their nerves a little bit by hanging around somehow it will come up about the outstandind invoice, this is where i say that i really think that it would be fair to ask for the money to be paid NOW. they will say 'hmm yes but maybe not' then i say i will sadly have to undo all the work i have done inclduding some things that are business critical.
if still no then there is real problem. at this point you seak to attorney/solicitor before doing the above dismantling (if applicable.)

I need to see if i am legally able to charge interest if so then why not 5-25% per day. This will all go in nice letter from legal execs this is something the company will have to act on. Then you can give a nice friendly word in there ear that they could still resolve this now by simply paying you/me

I think they will now pay. BUT if not then you must take legal action not to mention a boycott involving the offices/business that they trade out of. this depends on how much they owe and how much you care. For me it would be easy i hang around outside causing agro with high profile customers and bobs your uncle.

but yes it could all go wrong and they may be so hell bent on ripping you off that they are prepared to even go through the courts before they pay..but this is so unlikely...the bottom line is dont get visibly angry with them keep it profesional at all times, be overly nice even in a smarmy way especially when mentioning lawyers. Take down the hate site and pay them a visit if possible. and dont give them a reason to complain about you and turn the tables. try to play the game better than them.

sorry if i rambled,

Max.

maxim · 05-02-2006, 05:42 PM

I just found this regarding late payment by clients...if your in the Uk it may be useful it has answered some questions for me thats for sure.

http://www.payontime.co.uk/start_up/su_legislation.html

max.

GuyFromChicago · 05-03-2006, 09:15 AM

I've had clients that haven't paid. Back in the day I use to chase them down, call, e-mail, mail multiple bills and would involve the attorney if need be.

After awhile I realized the best way to deal with a client that doesn't/didn't pay is to forget about them and move on to the next client. Time is $ and every minute I spend chasing someone who won't pay is a minute I didn't spend working with a client that will.

yfs1 · 05-03-2006, 09:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alexavrutin

I have created a simple web page with our view of the issue (~1 hour) and put it on-line. Since the client's name was SemiCentral.com I registered the domain name www.semicentral-warning.com ($8.95 for the domain name at GoDaddy, hosted on our server so the hosting is free). Note that the name of the client's site appears as a full word on the domain name -- this is important for better ranking on search engines.

I have submitted the site to the major search engines (Google, Yahoo, MSN -- free) plus dozens smaller search engines automatically via TrafficBlazer ($19.95). Together with a couple of basic SEO techniques I expect the site to get ranked quite high when searching for "SemiCentral" and hopefully a couple of client's business domain terms, too.

After the site appears in search engines I am going to let the client know of this site and suggest that they follow the instructions on the site for their own good.

Any comments?

Be really careful with this as you are doing yourself a bit of damage fior two reasons:

1.) You are opening yourself up to legal action. You would most likely win but its going to cost you a lot of time and money to defend yourself.

2.) If future clients knew about this, it would show you as unprofessional at the very least. GFC's advice is good that you should funnel your energy into new customers and setting up processes that ensure you aren't in this situation again (Like Escrow or Partial Payments for Big Jobs)

Nobody wins in a pissing contest (Especially if it gets windy)

maxim · 05-04-2006, 09:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GuyFromChicago

After awhile I realized the best way to deal with a client that doesn't/didn't pay is to forget about them and move on to the next client. Time is $ and every minute I spend chasing someone who won't pay is a minute I didn't spend working with a client that will.

im sorry but that is poor advice. Never let someone go without paying its the heart and sole of your business! its great to give people freebies for something in return but to let people walk away with everything and your left with nothing but BAD feeling. Thats crazy. For a start if time is money then you lose double by walking away empty handed cos you spent time for nothing then your next client could not pay and your really in trouble. Put it this way if its more than $5/£5 then make sure you get it!

you wont get rich givin freebies or lettting customer rip you off.

maxim · 05-04-2006, 09:56 AM

also BTW

the client has just paid me!...and i didnt have to threaten to charge interest in the end.
My last semi official/semi threatening email worked

I guarantee anyone it pays to keep it really nice but firm and profesional at all times even if your absolutley tearing your hair out.

M

GuyFromChicago · 05-04-2006, 12:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maxim

im sorry but that is poor advice. Never let someone go without paying its the heart and sole of your business! its great to give people freebies for something in return but to let people walk away with everything and your left with nothing but BAD feeling. Thats crazy. For a start if time is money then you lose double by walking away empty handed cos you spent time for nothing then your next client could not pay and your really in trouble. Put it this way if its more than $5/£5 then make sure you get it!

you wont get rich givin freebies or lettting customer rip you off.

To each their own. I'm speaking from practical experience with hundreds of clients across various industries over the past decade. I've seen what works and I've seen what doesn't.

Time spent chasing debts that will most likely not be paid is time wasted. I would rather spend my time generating 10K worth of new business than chasing down 10K of old business.

New business is the lifeline of any company. When new business stops coming in the company starts dying. It may take years and years but without new business no company will survive.

Focus on the future - not trying to correct the past. Learn from it and move on.

Ashvin · 05-04-2006, 02:40 PM

I would agree with GuyFromChicago. I've perhaps lost more money trying to make those robbers pay than i would actually get if they paid me. Juts move on alex. But make sure you get paid first before doing any work now onwards.

maxim · 05-05-2006, 02:57 AM

that is plain crazy, giving up when someone says there not going to pay is just foolish it doesnt matter how long youve been in business non paying clients should be persued but i DID NOT say you should pursue them to to the end of the earth and at any expense. You dont need to obsess over a non paying customer. Just be firm,...that doesnt cost a dime.
If you read my suggested steps you will notice non of them are costly at all even a letter from your attorney would not cost much, mostly my attorney would do them for free.
So if you cant muster the energy to simply do the few steps ive written in my first post then i would be worried about the future of your business...because going it alone takes way more energy than working for someone else...as you have probably noticed already.
You cant be scared of awkward situations with customers/clients you just gota say whats required the reaction is rarely as bad as you would expect.

max.

designer007 · 05-05-2006, 03:41 AM

My client who was disturbing me online regarding the site changes, not comming online now-a- days. I think he take my design and ask some other people to make it as html.

These are the 2 designs:

If anyone found similar site, please inform me.